Saturday, 3 May 2014

THE ROMANS DO NOT OWN THE WORD CATHOLIC

The following comment was left on my Blog talking about Roman Catholic priests who continue in the priesthood in spite of having no faith and no theology:

"YOU NEED TO STOP DESCRIBING YOURSELF AS CATHOLIC BISHOP. THAT IS A LIE - AMONG MANY OTHERS ON THIS TRASHY BLOG OF YOURS. MAY GOD HAVE MERCY ON YOUR SOUL AND HEAL YOUR DISEASED MIND".

A number of issues arise:

1. WHAT IS A CATHOLIC BISHOP?

The person leaving the comment seems to think that the only kind of person who can be a "Catholic Bishop" is a MAN who is a Roman Catholic Bishop.

They are trying to limit the word "catholic" to officials of the Roman Catholic denomination or cult.

Christians take the word "catholic" from the Nicene Creed - AD 381 - that describes the Christian Church as the "one, holy, catholic and apostolic church".

This creed is recited every Sunday by the WHOLE CHURCH and is used in the liturgies and services of The Eastern Orthodox Church, The Oriental Orthodox Church, The Anglican Communion, The Presbyterian Church, The Luthern Church, The Methodist Church and many other Christian churches. In that sense the word "catholic", which comes from the Latin Catholicus and the Greek Katholikos meaning "universal" or "on the whole". All these churches believe in the unity sanctity and apostolicity of the church.

Many of these churches have bishops and in the truest sense possible their bishops can be called catholic bishops.

THE ROMANS AND I:

I was consecrated a bishop by a tredintine bishop and by an American bishop - both of whom are valid bishops from apostolic and theological points of view - but neither of whom claim to be members of the Roman hierarchy.

Their consecrations - and mine were theologically and spiritually valid in sacramental theology and in the context of the New Testament.

In fact in the days after my episcopal consecration the Roman Catholic Press Office in Dublin issued a statement - carried in the Irish media - saying that my consecration was valid.


2. A TRASHY BLOG?

I dispute the assertion that this Blog is trashy.

The Blog is honest, truthful, open and even blunt. Many blind and brainwashed followers of the Roman Catholic Cult do not their organisation being criticised.

But the world and its mother knows nowadays that this organisation / institution is corrupt from the top down.

In fact that is why the cardinals elected Pope Francis to clean up the dirty church.

But Francis is experiencing massive opposition in the Roman Curia and the Hierarchy to his clean up and clean out. It is quite unlikely that a pope in his 70's can overcome the evil cabal at the heart of the church. If he does it will be a miracle. 

GOD'S MERCY ON MY SOUL:

When I die I will have to stand before God and give an account of my life. It will be quite obvious at that moment that I will be standing before God as a sinner. In that context I will not be asking God for justice but I will indeed be depending on God's mercy.

Very few of us on our day of judgement will not be depending on the mercy of God.

MY DISEASED MIND?

Why does the commentator think I have a diseased mind?

Is it because I think for myself - with the brain God gave me?

Is it because I have fought hard all my life not to let the wheelers and dealers in the Roman Church brainwash me?

Is it because I insist on telling the truth?

Is it because I speak about the dark under belly of one of the most corrupt organisations in the history of the world?

As far as I am concerned my mind would be diseased if I had been successfully brainwashed.

I would have a diseased mind if I was a priest and a bishop who was covering up all the abuses of the organisation.

The real church is the People of God, the Body of Christ.

If it is a disease to want to see the Christian message proclaimed in all its original truth and beauty then yes - I have that disease and I hope that I have the terminal type!

+Pat Buckley
3.5.2014



37 comments:

  1. You are not a Bishop until the Pope says you are. If the Pope tells me that these other Christian people who dress up as Bishops are then they are, if not then not. Thay are not and you are not. You are a bitter homo man who has not moved on in life.

    Mary

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    Replies
    1. Mary - what the pope says makes everything ok ??????

      The pope ordered the murders of The Crusades. They're ok then?

      The pope ordered the tortures of the Spanish Inquisition. That ok too?

      John Paul 11 supported and protected the paedophile priest Marciel Maciel of the Legionaries of Christ. That good too?

      The pope made Keith O Brien who sexually abused seminarians and young priests a bishop and a cardinal. That was good too?

      Was John Paul 11's greatest miracle that he could turn EVIL into GOOD?

      If the pope asked you to get pregnant for him would that be God asking you to get pregnant?

      As long as there are Cat-licks like you Rome will prosper

      Pat

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    2. Dear Mary,

      As a theologian I find your reasoning akin to that of a suicide bomber! In fact is there any thinking going on there at all. If the Pope tells you?? Really, in 2014 we have Catholics living their faith in blind obedience to the Pope. I am not so sure if I am afraid or horrorfied!

      As for the D&C PP, you are encouraging mindlessness! Although mindlessness is what fills the coffers of the Roman Church today, only a mindless fool could give to it today!

      Mary you get the priests you deserve, the double life of the D&C PP, sounds like a good novel!!!

      Maynooth

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  2. Let's pray for each other, physical and spiritual health.
    Please work for the unity of the church, with loving words and what units us, not what decides and gas hurt you.
    Thank you for removing the very hurtful comments on the installation of Donal McKown as bishop I'd Derry.

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    Replies
    1. I agree that UNITY is a great goal.

      Are we to sweep all the dirt of the day under the Carpet of Unity.

      Is that not CONFORMITY rather than unity?

      Pat

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  3. Obviously a very raw nerve has been touched Pat by those of us who have the audacity to stand up to the fantasy and nonsense your spout when you call yourself "bishop". The viciousness with which you have replied to Mary says a lot about you and your total lack of pastoral concern, let alone basic human manners. Why descend to the level of those who attack you if you are so sure in the validity of your orders? If you were secure in what you claim you would sure keep your comments to the arguments and not engage in petty-minded attacks of those challenging you. Mary hit the nail on the head when she said you were a bitter... man who had not moved on in life. The truth is surely that when your ambitions to be a Bishop in the Catholic Church went nowhere (and how could they Pat, you would "start a row in an empty house", as we Northerners say) you got yourself made a bishop any way you could, in your case by getting a lunatic to lay hands on you. That does not make you a bishop in any way in which the Christian Church would accept, even acknowledge. The Emperor has no clothes Pat, however he may dress himself in purple and gold. D&C PP

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    1. Dear D&C PP

      No raw nerve was touched. I have been a very happy priest for 38 years and a happy bishop for 16.

      The only ones I need to have my presbyterial and episcopal priesthood affirmed by are God and God's People. Thankfully that affirmation comes every day.

      Yes I did reply very robustly to Mary who has been brainwashed into believing that Black is White JUST because a pope says it is. Rational, theological and common sense arguments cannot penetrate this kind of ignorance.

      Mary said that I was "a bitter homo man". Why did you leave the "homo" word out when you quoted her?

      Was it because you rightly are uncomfortable with her homophobia?

      Was it because you recognise that her use of the word homo points to her RC brainwashing?

      Or was it because of your own lifestyle or the lifestyle of most of your fellow D&C colleagues?

      For your information my episcopacy has been acknowledged on many occasions in Christian churches and communities - even in the RC denomination.

      I agree that the Emperor has no clothes - but wonder then why people like you continue to follow the Roman Emperor Mark 11 - the Roman Pontifex?

      The BIG difference between me and you is that I am openly and public what I am and put my name to everything I write.

      Who are you - Father Anonymous?

      +Pat

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  4. Your blog is Not TRASHY. Sometimes a bit "tabloidy" but not everyone reads the Times. As for the word Catholic. Even the proddies use it when reciting the Creed. The word means universal as in everywhere. Jesus did not make Peter the first Pope he made him leader of the 12. The smells and bells and popery came later. It took me a long time to be comfortable with the fact that Roman Catholicism does not own Christianity. I put this down to my monoculturalistic southern irish catholic upbringing. I am not knocking my past. It is what it is. Christianity is a challenging and exciting journey. Sometimes we need to let go of the image of the God we think we believe in in order to find the God who believes in us. Sean

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  5. Sean,

    I agree.

    But sometimes the image of God we have was imposed on us by others

    Pat

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  6. Dear Brother Bishop Pat,

    I once again read the sheer ignorance on this blog. You have it from Rome yourself anyway, but you are valid! May I please educate Mary & the Parish Priest from the Ecumenical Desk - if they know what this means!!!

    Part 1) The only truly ecumenical symbol of faith, the Nicene Creed, outlines the reality of the Church in four adjectives (the notae ecclesiae) pointing to aspects of its nature. The Church is one, holy, catholic, apostolic. This statement about the Church occurs in the short pneumatological section, and thus makes the Church an object of belief and confessing. The marks of the Church must be somehow – in all ambiguity – manifest and answered for by the members of the Church.

    1. The unity of the Church has its source in the triune God. But how and where is this unity to be perceived? Old Catholic theology would give an answer in the framework of an ecclesiology taking as its basic entity the local Church. This ecclesiology is discernible without any systematic explication in some authors writing in the 1870es (e.g. J.H.Reinkens), but a certain consistency has been attained only later, not least because of a theological exchange with voices from the Orthodox and Anglican (also Lutheran) traditions, recently with the Ecumenical Desk advocates a communion ecclesiology, and generally with the work of the Faith and Order Movement / Commission.

    The starting point is the eucharistic community headed by a bishop; in what follows this is called the "local Church“. A few remarks will be appropriate. The Eucharist with all its constitutive elements is the primary representation and realisation of the communion of God with humans constituted in the Christ event and opened up for continuous participation in the power of the Holy Spirit. The traditional term "bishop“ designates the person who has the first responsibility for the local Church to preserve its unity, as well as its catholicity and apostolicity. The bishop is, however, fully integrated in a network of distinct levels: on the one hand with the college of presbyters (usually called "priests“) and with the deacons, who together with the bishop assume the tasks of The ordained ministry, on the other hand with the non-ordained baptiSed, the laity, who share the responsibility for the local Church in various ways.[1] The synodal integration of the bishop into the local Church and the participation of all ordained ministers and the laity in the responsibility for the local Church to remain the Church of God has been one of the principal concerns of Old Catholic reforms after 1870. Old Catholic theology will happily recogniSe a similar concern in the modern debate on episkopé and its personal, collegial and communal dimensions. It will interpret the personal dimension in terms of what may be called „monepiscopacy“ (not to be confused with „monarchical episcopacy“ and its modern associations).[2]

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  7. Part 2) A further explanation may be in place: why is it not the parish / oratory and its local congregation that serves as the ecclesiological starting point? This has to do with taking into account historical developments: e.g. the bishoprics consisting of a town and its immediate hinterland were soon superseded by bishoprics consisting of a region, the presbyters now assuming episcopal functions in the eucharistic liturgy of the local congregations. But there are other considerations. The basic unit (called local Church / oratory) ought to fulfill all its tasks as far as possible by its own capacity. For this a parish is very often too small. On the other hand there should be a limit to the circumscription of a local Church: the bishop ought to know in person those who assume responsibility in a local congregation, e.g. the ordained ministers and leading members of a parish council. If this is the case in Old Catholic dioceses that may even cover large areas it is because of their status as extreme minority Churches.[3]

    Now the local Church / Oratory is a representation and realisation of the One Church confessed in the Nicene Symbol of Faith, and this in a particular "place“. The extent of the "place“ is dependent on contingent factors (number of baptised, historical developments etc).

    2. The catholicity of the Church / Oratory is to be determined in the context of the ecclesiological approach just presented. It is the local Church that carries the mark of catholicity inasmuch as it participates in God’s reality of salvation and truth encompassing heaven and earth and there finds its unifying centre. The local Church, however, does not possess catholicity for itself, like a monad, but insofar as it is in communion with other local Churches, which are equally representations of the One Church in their respective "places“. D&C is no fully Catholic until it is communion with the Oratory!

    Thus the local Churches have a soteriological-trinitarian identity - an identity, incidentally, that is to be distinguished from other identities that are marked by manifold sociocultural factors and are and should be diverse. This "theological“ identity points to the real source of the unity of the local Churches, the triune God.

    This unity is manifest in the form of a communion of local Churches (i.e. Ecumenism), not in the form of something like a super-diocese with the dioceses thus being deficient, somewhat incomplete parts of a larger whole.

    There will be communions of local Churches in various geographical extensions, up to the universal communion of local Churches. They are all representations of the One Church, each in their "place“ and history.

    From all this follows that the catholicity of the Church is not simply identical with its (geographical - Roman) universality.

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  8. Part 3) The apostolicity of the Church is also to be seen in the context of the local Church being in communion with other local Ecumenical Churches. It denotes the continuity of the Church in space and time with the mission of Christ and his apostles performed in the power of the Holy Spirit. This continuity is related to the entire witness of the Church in Word and Sacrament, although some constitutive elements can be singled out, but should not be seen in isolation, (Which Mary % PP is doing to the local Church - Oratory). The passing on of the ordained ministry by prayer and the laying-on of hands is such an element of what is called "apostolic succession“, but it must be integrated into the ecclesial context of the co-responsability of the local Church for its remaining true to the Gospel and in continuity with the Ancient Church. The apostolic succession is in the first and last analysis the process of the Church remaining identical with the apostolic foundation in all forms of inculturation and aggiornamento that will necessarily create varying identities of another order. The Oratory fulfils all elements!

    A clear manifestation of the apostolicity of the Church may be seen in the consecration of a bishop: he is elected by the local Church, ordained by bishops of other Church in communion with it (fulfilled); and in what takes place in the eucharistic context all baptised present share in the commitment of the Church to the passing on of the faith once and for all revealed and yet laid into the obedient responsibility of the Church. Two dimensions can be discerned in the event: the "horisontal“ historical continuity within the supralocal communion and the "vertical“ immediacy to God (made clear in the epicletic ordination prayer).

    Bishop Pat - I am not sure about you but I am growing tired expalining your validness both in Rome and on your blog.

    Your friend in Rome - Brother Bishop & Professor of Theology

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    [1] Cf. Stalder, K., 1984: 110-125.


    [2] Cf. Baptism, Eucharist and Ministry, Faith and Order Paper 111, WCC, Geneva, 1982, para. 26 (without the term episkopé); The Nature and Purpose of the Church. A stage on the way to a common statement, Faith and Order Paper 181, WCC, Geneva, 1998, para 89-106. See further Bouteneff, Peter C. and Falconer, Alan D. (eds) Episkopé and Episcopacy and the Quest for Visible Unity. Two Consultations, Faith and Order Paper 183, WCC, Geneva ,1999.


    [3] In Germany, Switzerland, Austria, the Czech Republic, Croatia and Slovakia the single diocese covers the whole country.

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  9. Broad Minded Parishioner3 May 2014 at 20:23

    Oh Mary - you do not sound very Christian to me. There but for the grace of God. What have "homos" done to you? Why do you have to be so hateful? Before you "have a go" I am female and married so have no particular vested interest other than I don't see why you have to be so full of venom. I would say that you sound bitter.

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  10. There is a real issue in the Catholic Church and I can only speak as a 'Catholic' Theologian. I teach in Catholic Univeristies and I am wheeled out to teach cross ecumenical courses in Reformed Universities. I am well educated, mostly through the S.J's in various parts of the world!

    The sheer Theological and even more the basic Philosophical IGNORANCE amongst the Catholic people and even more so in Catholic clergy is nothing short of criminal. They are running a Church through law and rules whilst struggling to comprehend the meaning and depth of the minsitry of Jesus and Christian Church and Churches (I refuse to use Ecclesial Communities).

    I with other scholars tried to examine this ignorance of Theological Reception amongst the clergy, for instance on ARCIC I, II or III, only one simple dialogue! Most laughed at us and aggressively told us to get a life! What we found was a 'black hole' as such in theological understanding amongst the clergy. We were met with levels of aggression that would actually chill the spine. Of those clergy who were reading, only read Papal teachings and Vatican teachings!!! Most actual considered Papal watching via social media as 'keeping up' with current thinking!

    Needless to say the my 'boss' disallowed the study to continue! The clergy complained, the Bishop or two picked up the phone and out of blind obedience or threat the study STOPPED!! This is the true level of 'thinking' in our Church, if it does not suit the sword is presented! Threat followed by the destruction of ones career follows - why - I want to educate and punch a hole through Theological Ignorance.

    I understand the Bishop from Rome and in my humble opinion I say; that the PP D&C and Mary will not and cannot understand your Theology (ecclesiology), their level of Theological thinking does not go beyond the level of Papal Watching!

    Very, very scary but reality. The majority of thinking people have already left the Church in mind and Spirit.

    Theologian - Dublin

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  11. I left the RCC 10 years ago, I mean left it completely behind me.

    The First Reason I Left Is Because The Catholics Do Not Have The Right Attitude Toward The Truth!
    To illustrate what I mean by this, I will explain the difference in the two sides. Those with the right attitude toward the truth are always willing to test what they teach with others. They invite those of opposite views to work together for truth and unity. They appreciate when those who differ with them point out where they think they are wrong. They have everything thoroughly tested, studying arguments both for and against, looking at both sides of the question.

    Those with the wrong attitude toward the truth are not willing to test what they teach in fair and open discussion, privately or publicly. They do not invite others to point out where they think they are wrong, and do not appreciate when others try to do so. They won't allow their members to hear both sides of an issue, and especially they don't want them to examine opposing arguments.

    Hopefully, one can now understand what I mean when I said the Catholics do not have the right attitude toward the truth. Catholics are not allowed, and especially are not encouraged to hear both sides regarding truth and error. They are not to read books which differ from their doctrine. Thus, they are encouraged by the clergy to be closed minded to anything which differs from Catholicism. We ask, "Why don't Catholic officials encourage their members to examine opposing Scriptural teaching?" False teachers have learned that when truth and error are examined side by side, some begin to see the truth. False teachers are afraid of being exposed and of losing their members.

    John

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  12. http://www.votf-li.org/Reese-The%20hidden%20exodus%205-11.pdf

    An excellent piece of research conducted by an SJ and before people jump up and down, he is only exploring and researching for TRUTH.

    Jim

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  13. When I returned to the Catholic Church after a 5-year hiatus (I was one of the 54 percent at the time), the topic of Catholics leaving came up in a parish group meeting. Members of the group insisted - despite my personal testimony to the contrary - that people were leaving because of a departure from tradition.

    Sadly, this type of thinking dominates the USCCB, as well as the largest Catholic media organizations. Don't hold your breath waiting for change. They just don't get it.

    Fabio

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  14. As a theologically trained, (Master's in Theology, plus 15 years of hospital chaplaincy and various other specialized training), I am still relegated to mainly helping with setting up events, like moving tables, etc. There is nothing wrong with that, but the Church first encouraged the laity to get theologically educated, and now there are thousands who are so, now, they really don't know or are afraid to use them in the roles to which they are trained. I work for a Catholic hospital, but am still hamstrung, as are all of my similar colleagues, in areas like Sacrament of the Sick, which can only be administered by a priest. People do die before finding a priest in time, on occasion, when nationally Catholic accredited lay Chaplains are on the scene, and rendered helpless to provide exactly what the person and/or family wish from their church. How can this possibly be what God intends? Why do young people, especially leave the Catholic Church. Perhaps they are not being fed, or are given the options of being fed and nurtured by other, non-denominational, and are exercising that option-because they feel spiritually happy and fulfilled. If the Church continues to draw lines in the sand over topics that cannot even be discussed, and spreading third party anecdotal stories as "evidence," it is no wonder that educated people respectfully and with legitimacy, criticize the Church, are frustrated, and often leave to find people who are open to discussion, joyful in music and celebration in liturgies, and seem to understand the phrase, "make a joyful noise unto the Lord." I pray,attend Mass, participate, believe in the Real Presence, but I am profoundly sad about all of this. I have no answers, but thinking "outside clerical boxes" seems to be a very good idea.

    Edward

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  15. Excellent blog, especially the observation that lapsed Catholics are often more informed than the average congregant! Only the thinking purposefully walk away, those that stay, stay because their salary depends on it - they normally become unhappy in Spirit.

    Something the hierarchy and the "true believers" seem blind to. Mary & PP!!!

    Ryan

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  16. It's boring, it costs money, the people there have the personalities of gerbils, the clergy are either closet cases or semi-out of the closet left-of-center freaks, the politics are nearly as stupid as the economics; why bother? What's in it for me?

    I say all of this with respect but conviction.

    Stan

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  17. When a number of priests not acting in a bad manner and the church keeping it secret why would you want to stay in a church like that?

    Catholic High School Student

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  18. I know of multiple lapsed Catholics. The most common reason is that they got remarried without an annulment. The next reason is the sex abuse scandal — to date our parish priests have not mentioned it once during a Mass. And lastly, politics.

    I think — without offending — it is easier to belong to other religions and it takes a lot of effort to be a Catholic. I know that I always feel perpetually guilty, a symptom of my parochial school education and corporal punishment by nuns. LOL.

    George

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  19. A few Sundays ago the New York Times magazine had an article on the sex abuse scandal in Ireland, “The Irish Affliction.” When a woman, who was voicing her anger, was asked by a reporter if she was ready to leave the Church, she answered: “Where would I go?”

    Many Catholics feel stuck!!!!

    Katie

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  20. Four of my siblings left in their teen-young adult years when other churches offered vibrant gatherings for that age. They met their spouses there and stayed. The church used to say they’d come back for marriage or baptism.
    That’s no longer the case. They – and now their teen-young adult kids are very involved in other churches. The Catholic church could learn a lot from megachurches in how to get, and keep, people interested and involved.

    Marylynn

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  21. Don’t judge — listen! Don’t speak or interrupt — listen ! When you listen, you will hear that the pain is in their heart — not in their intellect.

    For years, I worked with an outreach ministry for “Ex-Catholic Fundamentalists.” I never once heard any complaint about dogma or doctrine from those folks but I heard a lot of complaints about callous Catholic pastors, unfriendly and unwelcoming parishioners, and rules that kept sinners out rather than welcoming them in.

    Try this experiment yourself. Contact any local evangelical pastor of a mega-church in your area and ask him/her point blank how many ex-Catholics are in their congregation. Their best guess is that it will be 50-60%. And those ex-Catholics are leaders in those evangelical/fundamentalist parishes, demonstrating skills they could have used for the betterment of our own parishes but we turned them away.

    The fact that they left is not their fault — it is ours!

    NOW — to reverse the insight. Ask yourself how effective is your RCIA program? If you do not have one or have not had a candidate in years, maybe it is time for some serious self-reflection and ask the simple question “Why would a truly searching spirit-filled person NOT want to join my church ?”

    Deacon Norb USA

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  22. Rambling thoughts here. I’ve stayed Catholic in spite of Catholics. I moved from a large Catholic suburban parish many years ago to a much smaller semi-rural one. I’ve seldom felt like I’ve seen the face of Jesus in my parish. Never felt the friendship and love that I’ve felt since I became music director at a Lutheran parish. Never felt the connection with a pastor as I have with the Lutheran woman pastor. The level of love and sacrifice of time and money given from this parish to the homeless and others in need still blows me away – and I’ve been working here for three years.

    I don’t believe that anyone who joins this parish comes for the entertainment. There isn’t any. Just a weekly liturgy. Do I think they really understand their faith? Most likely, not. But I see the face of Jesus, the face of Love, in how they live, work, and pray. They understand the essentials. It is just a small rural parish where I feel blessed to be working.

    For those who say that those who leave don’t have the understanding of the fullness of faith, I would probably agree to a certain extent. But as I have read in this combox, mostly people are blamed for seeking “entertainment,” or “spiritual fulfillment,” elsewhere. Don’t let the door hit you on the way out. What I’m seeing in those comments is the sort of out-of-touch judgementalism that, if I allowed it, would send me into the arms of the Lutheran Church. So what keeps me Catholic? The Eucharist, plain and simple. I’ve been to in-depth Protestant bible studies,and benefited greatly; worked in a couple of Protestant churches. My non-Catholic husband has always expected I’d join ‘em. He doesn’t understand the Eucharist, and what it means to me.

    As to converts, my question would be: how many are still Catholic ten years after?

    I said this would be rambling. There is enough “blame” to go around as to why the church is losing members. We need to honestly look at ourselves and ask: Do they see the Face of Jesus in me?

    Barbarra

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  23. Thank God I left this brainwashing institution. After 12 years of being taught by feminine priests and sexually frustrated nuns it was a relief to see sanity in the Protestant church where they allow you to express your natural sexuality through marriage.

    Mike - Ex-OFM

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  24. I have been a catholic for 51 years. I have been a very active catholic for a number of years-have taught religious education for 25 years, cantored for over 30 years, a St. Vincent de Paul thrift store manager for 13 years just to name a few. I attempted to annul my second marriage which ended due to the fact my former spouse molested my daughter from my first marriage. He was convicted on one felony count and two misdemeanor counts. The Tribunal refused to address the molestation and wanted to annul based on the fact we used birth control (we were both almost 40 and had 4 kids between us). Then my parish, which has had a HUGE influx of members from Mexico, did a feasibility survey to see about raising 7.5 million dollars to build a new church (the last time I checked we are in a recession, right?). Only 14% of the over 6000 registered families responded to the survey and they have decided to move forward anyway!!! I am done and will begin church shopping this weekend.

    Mrs. Mac

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  25. My quest for a new church ended three months ago. I feel liberated. I feel wonderful. I wish you all well and hope you feel no guilt or fear in making that decision.

    If I lived in Ireland I would belong to the Oratory, take courage.

    Gina

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  26. I left the Catholic Church in 2004. I am 57 my husband is 58 and both of us went to Catholic school, we sent our son to Catholic school. I had been a faithful member all my life except for 10 years I left when I was 18 after a monseigneur told me I committed a mortal sin for reading the Bible. I returned and then left again 21 years later. The reasons I left for good were: The truth. I started going to Bible study classes, and studied several on my own, lead by the Spirit of God in me. I learned that the Catholic teaching were actually not true, if one tries to line up with the teaching of the Lord in the Bible. Examples: We are not to go to another man for the forgiveness of our sins. The curtain was torn when Jesus died, once and for all. We are now able to go to God through Jesus. Nothing in the Bible said to go to a priest, other than in the old testament when the Jews took sacrifices to the high priest. He is just another man, just like me another sinner, who needs the blood of Jesus to cover me, the pope included. Catholics believe in praying to the saints. We are told in the Bible that we are a saint if we are believers. I respect and have high regard for our Lord’s mother, Mary. But I don’t think the teachings are correct to pray to her for intercession through her for favors to get to Jesus. The statues in the church mislead some of the older people. I have seen them kissing the feet of a Mary statue or bring the statue flowers. That is idol worship, not a “reminder,” like I was told by a priest when I asked about it. I don’t believe the wine and bread turn into the body and blood of Christ. Once again you are crucifying Jesus all over again. He told us to do this in remembrance of Him so we would not forget that he died for our sins once and for all, the new Covenant. The priest should also remind the parishioners that if we have something against someone else to leave and go settle the problems and then come back for the Lord’s supper. My mother was sick for a really long time. She laid there paralyzed in her bed for 5 years. During that time I asked the parish priest to come and see her. I think he showed up once. They want to charge you now to say a rosary. The priest in this parish has a very small church. My pastor, and another pastor from one of the hospice nurses came to see mom at least once a week. She had been a devout Catholic all her life. Did you really care about her? “Protestant ministers cared more than her priest did. Just another example how we feel. Catholic church doesn’t care. No compassion. When one is baptized one should really know and accept Jesus as their Savior. The priest who molest children should have been dealt with as it states in the Bible. You swept it under the rug. A child pedophile. Just transferred to another parish. So many men now days are homosexual as a result of what was allowed to happen. I don’t believe there are degrees of sin. I think a sin is a sin no matter how small or great. The church’s mortal sin for not going to Sunday mass is not in the Bible and is an example of what I am talking about. I think that people know that as a Christian you want to go to church and worship and fellowship with others. People now days are starved for the truth. You preach the truth and you will fill up your seats. People are tired of “religion.” We want fellowship and truth and knowledge about God. We want a personal relationship with God. We have a need to know God’s word, truthfully. You could start with these as a beginning.

    Jean

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  27. I have been Catholic all my life and I have recently been led by the Holy Spirit to consider my faith more critically. The biggest problem that I have been running into is the absolute requirement for sacramental confession, with the only other alternative being Hell. Try as I might, I can’t find the part of Christ’s character and teachings that tell us that he came to save us… as long as we do all the right rituals at the right time or else. This comes from my human weakness — it is hard to confess secret sexual sins to a celibate man. But it is a good thing to do just because it’s difficult? Or did Christ envision a more loving, modest means of forgiveness? Think with compassion about a teenage girl struggling with masturbation. Imagine the difficulty of being a 14 or 15 year old female and knowing that your choices are (1) Go sit in a closet and tell a 35-50 year old celibate male who knows your voice because you have been a member of the parish since you were born that you masturbated or (2) burn in hell. It is hard for me to believe that Jesus Christ would put us to that kind of decision. For me, it’s not about me wanting to be able to “get away with” things that the Church teaches are sins — I do not disagree with Catholic teachings about sex, masturbation, birth control, or divorce. What I disagree with is the humiliating, terrifying requirement of having to legalistically confess all of your individual sins before Jesus can forgive you. That seems like trying to put God in a box, and it doesn’t seem right. Interestingly, since I made my first “private” confession to God a few months ago, I feel an outpouring of grace that has helped me repent and turn from sin with so much more success than the fear of confession ever did.

    Lisa

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  28. People leave the church because all are not welcome. It’s as simple as that. Jesus did not teach that we need to be catholic to receive communion. Jesus does not want us to be separate from our brothers and sisters in Christ. We are to have a welcoming heart. In our church, in order to take communion, you have to be a follower of Christ. That means people of ALL FAITHS are welcome at the communion table. I once attended a catholic funeral where the majority of the sermon the priest gave was how the non-catholics had better not take communion. Imagine that. A friend of mine works for the diocese and told of a time she asked for prayer for a friend of hers who was dying. The priest asked, “Is he catholic?” Seriously? If this is what the catholic church is all about – exclusion – then I want no part of it.

    Jan

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  29. I’m considering leaving the church because- yes my spiritual needs are not being met- I feel like the church is just loosely worshiping Jesus when I need Him every day. I’m on fire for God and I need to be around others who feel that way too., I also despise the “new/old” 2011 mass- it’s clunky, sexist, and the Latin translation is incorrect. I miss the ’73 mass!! It just doesn’t feel like “home” anymore., I’m disgusted that I have to bow down to “some dude(s)” when we all know humans are flawed- what happened to obedience to CHRIST!!, and my biggest reason…the Church seems to have deviated from the bible- Why is it when I mention that I believe in Creation (I am a young-earth creationist), I’m treated like a monster by my fellow Catholics (even some priests and nuns!!) but evolutionary theory is treated like biblical doctrine?

    JR

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  30. I am a Catholic convert as of 4 years ago. I am now contemplating leaving after reading our bishop’s letter regarding the HHS ruling that employers have to cover contraception, sterilization, etc. in their health insurance plans for workers. How in the world can the Church not realize that as a CHURCH, it can tell members not to use contraception, but that as an EMPLOYER, it has to follow the laws which pertain to employers? The bishop said, “We cannot–we will not–comply with this unjust law.” Doesn’t that mean that Church officials are intending to engage in criminal behavior. Do they not realize that the Church hasn’t made the law since the fourteenth century? I’m not sure that I can continue as a Catholic–I am SO angry that the Church is so regressive and out of touch with today’s realities.

    I managed to get past the child molestation stuff and the fact that I could not remarry if I became Catholic because of my divorce, but really, come on! I don’t think I can get past this. The Church needs to get over itself.

    MKL

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  31. This is why I left the church:
    1. Priests: I had dealings with some of the most disgusting people who call themselves religious professionals, through my business and on a personal level. The personal level was definitely the harder one to take, with their “holier than thou” attitude. To me, they are just full of all that b.s. nonsense that they are getting fed with in the seminary, especially their bias against women, their closed-mindedness and general arrogance towards anyone who dares to ask questions.
    2. Ratzinger: I cannot accept him as my pope. This guy in his Armani suits and gold cufflings and pink silk shoes is despicable. He lives in his own world. Like all popes before him he is only interested in increasing the church’s power by controlling the minds of his “subjects”. And the sheep follow willingly.
    3. I am deeply spiritual, I believe in God the Creator of us all. I pray. But leave me alone with all that religious nonsense, especially of the catholic church. This church with its 2000 year shameful history and man-made canon laws has nothing to do anymore with what the man Jesus taught.

    Mynona Revetahw

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  32. We recently left the Catholic Church. My wife was the daughter of a catholic deacon and I followed her to the new church. As mentioned above in your article, my wife enjoyed the Methodist service better, the openness and friendly welcome we received. We felt left out and alienated from our parish. Our two young sons were baptized Catholic, but enjoyed the new church’s programs for young children. We felt that over the years some clergy were insincere and were always looking for money. The sad thing is… I love the Catholic Church, but many of the wrongs over the ages really hurt us, the committed believers. The front doors of our local parish were donated by my wife’s grandmother; we were married there by her father with special permission from the archdiocese. I was never a “church goer” on a regular basis when my father-in-law was living. Today I teach bible school at our new church and stand on the education board for their Christian School. I just came back from a meeting with a priest about a friend from high school who is getting married. He was kind of mean until he found out we left the church. I will pray for the church, I will do as Jesus did… love all and forgive. It’s a shame good Christian’s are turned away from such a corrupt and evil behavior of a few. I felt my friend was on trial. After watching the nightly news, it all just makes me feel sick.

    Luke 6:37:
    “Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.”

    God Bless you all:-)
    Rob

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  33. Lol, no wonder this gay man doesn't have sense. What cult do you belong Pat?

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