Tuesday, 11 October 2016



Is DIARMUID MARTIN a real champion of truth, justice and transparency in the Catholic Church?

Or is Diarmuid Martin just another "political" priest who is driven by ambition and who wants a cardinal's red hat at any cost.

These are the questions that many are asking about him on this blog and elsewhere.

I can reveal TODAY that during the recent MAYNOOTH GRINDR SCANDAL Diarmuid Martin and I exchanged emails and that he telephoned me on a number of occasions about the issues involved. 

I has chosen NOT to say that he and I had been in communication because I knew that if the other Irish Bishops knew he was communicating with me and talking to me they would dislike him even more than they already do.

It was not important that the Archbishop of Dublin was talking to me. It WAS important that he was been kept up to date about the information I was receiving - BECAUSE - I was full of hope that he was really going to do something substantial about Maynooth and the gay subculture in MAYNOOTH and even in his own DUBLIN ARCHDIOCESE. 

I have now more or less lost hope in Diarmuid Martin - as have many who read this blog and indeed many who do not read it.

I am wondering if Diarmuid Martin used the recent Maynooth Grindr scandal to have a go at a place he does not like - a place he does not like going to.

I am wondering if he used the recent scandal in his "political" battle with his fellow bishops - many of whom dislike him.

I am wondering if he used the recent scandal as a GOOD PR STUNT - a PR stunt that might get him more notice among the Irish Public and in Rome - and a PR stunt that might have led to his name been included on Pope Francis' list of NEW CARDINALS this week?

And I have other questions and doubts:

1. Why is Diarmuid Martin not publishing his list of clerical changes this year - but quietly moving priests one by one?

2. Why is Diarmuid Martin doing nothing about the MANIFOLD PRO CATHEDRAL PROBLEM which has been festering for some 7 years?

3. What is Diarmuid Martin doing about the BALBRIGGAN PROBLEM?

4. Why did Diarmuid Martin sent Fr David Brough secretly to Arklow and his name does not even appear on the parish website there?

5. What was the rationale in sending Gorgeous to Rome?

6. Why does Diarmuid Martin run Dublin like an ABSENTEE LANDLORD?

7. Is Diarmuid Martin's heart in Rome and not in Dublin?

8. Why did Diarmuid give Shane O'Doherty a 30 second meeting?

At the beginning of this summer I thought that Diarmuid Martin was THE BEST OF A BAD LOT.

Now I am wondering if he could be the most cunning and cynical of THE BAD LOT?

Of course I am open to having my mind changed. 

Maybe some people in Rome have the same concerns that we have about Diarmuid?

Each day there are many readers on the blog from Italy and Rome.


Could that have played some LITTLE part in him NOT getting the red hat this week?

Is DIARMUID part of the problem and NOT part of the solution?

Has he taken all of us who put some / partial or a lot of trust in him for a ride?





Bishop Pat Buckley

 I believe that in this world it is impossible to understand God.
I believe that God made this wonderful universe and all that exists.
I can find God in nature, in animals, in birds and the environment.
I believe that God made all men and women,
That He made them all equal,
And that He loves and cherishes them all equally.
I believe that the whole human race is the family of God.
I believe that there may be intelligent life on other planets
And if so, they too are part of God’s family.
I hold that religion and faith are two different things,
That religion can be both good and bad
And that it is spirituality that counts.
For me your religion is an accident of your birth
Or a gift of God’s great providential diversity.
There is no one true church.
All churches and all religions contain aspects of the truth.
But only God is truth.
No man is infallible.
A Buddhist or a good atheist is as acceptable to God as a good Catholic.
I believe that sex is good and so is the body.
The only sexual act that is sinful is the one that uses or abuses.
I believe in people, especially suffering people.
I believe in the power of weakness.
I believe that all men and women will be saved.
I believe in a packed Heaven and an empty Hell.
And even Satan might get another chance.
I believe in the freedom of God’s sons and daughters.
I believe that dogma is often evil.
I believe that life is a journey towards God
And that no one has the right to insist that you go a certain road.
I believe that God and reality are too big for my poor words.
I believe therefore that I am only at a beginning.
Only knocking at a door.
And I believe that the best is yet to come.



  1. This is big news PAt.

    Has any other bishop been in touch with you?

    WE have a right to know.

    1. No. Just Diarmuid.

      He actually rang me from Frankfurt Airport on is way to World Youth Day.

    2. Just interested - why are you saying you have a RIGHT to know?

      Diarmuid Martin never asked me to keep our contact confidential.

      But say a bishop did?

  2. We have a right to know jack shit. If someone decides to reach out to Pat, it is Pat's buisness if he wants to make it public or not. I have said it on this blog for weeks. Someone has something on Diarmuid. It is like he was threatened or blackmailed after he went public about Maynooth. In have said also before that he is not liked by Priests or people in Dublin. He never wanted Dublin. He cannot wait for 3 more years to be done so he can het out of Dublin. I sense he is scared now because with no red hat, where will he go ? Will their be a place for him in Rome ? Not without a red hat. No doubt he is covering up for brough etc and others by not making public the proest changes. Just similar to covering up child abuse. I think Diarmuid is just a loser and waste of space like his other brother goonies in the purple and lace.

    1. Thanks HH. I have had a great deal of contact from people via email, telephone, snail mail who asked for confidentiality and I ALWAYS observe that.

      DM never asked for confidentiality. He was interested in what I knew that would help him.

      If a bishop asked for confidentiality I would respect that unless it concerned child safety or criminal matters.

  3. Anyone would know the DM wanted the news for himself-
    Did he know the red hats were going to be given out and he was hoping for it?
    Strange goings on indeed!

    1. At 72 Diarmuids career is coming to an end.

      The red hat has receeded a great deal and maybe dead in the water.

      What will DM do with his remaining ambition?

      Has frustration / hopelessness set in?

  4. It's probably the grinder boys reading in Italy
    They have nothing else to do, just like when they in gaynooth
    The MONEY is running out for them and for bishops
    Why would DM worry about a red hat, sure he can live out his life on a state pension just like the rest of us
    Far too many here obsessed about red hads...you included Pat
    Why oh why did you make yourself a bishop
    I would respect you more if u were just a humble priest
    Going off this blog big time,you haven't solved the mystery of where the money went to in Canada

  5. The distribution of red hats has become a lottery with Francis. Most of those named last Sunday would not have been expecting it at all. Anyway there are still two Irish cardinals, one of them unfortunately not yet 80. More importantly DM's "Rome" is now ancient history and will remain so if the Holy Spirit gets her way with the next conclave.

  6. He does not like having Auxillary Bishops. He has Vicar Foranes who help him administer the Sacrament of Confirmation in the Archdiocese. Most recent one is Liam o Cuiv who he appointed to Killester last month to replace Msgr Alex Stenson.

    1. Liam O Cuiv was in Clonliffe with me.

      What about making Canon O'Reilly and Frs Brough, Derwin and Deacon Gorgeous auxiliary bishops.

      These seem to be men he can work with?

  7. It would be dangerous Pat what those listed anove would do with Chrism.

  8. I agree with 10.35- there is no point in giving out about bishops Pat when you present yourself as a prince of the Church- Profile pic in purple vestments, expensive Cross, same old giving out every day.
    I agree, where is the humble priest who was loved by his people?

    1. Cardinals are princes of the church not bishops.

      My pectoral cross was £40 on ebay.

      I very seldom wear purple.

      The priest people loved is still here in Larne and still doing what he always did.

  9. Youse are worse than the politicians
    Always wondering about who is going to be a bishop
    And all the posters talking about who was going to be bishop of Clogher and the famous Tim
    The laity don't give a fig about all this
    And we are the people keep youse

  10. If you are not more careful, Pat, you will loose contact with Martin. You do not know his timescales or what he is doing in the background. It is unreasonable to ask somebody in any difficult situation to make public all they are doing and in a very brief period of time. You should give him a minimum of 12 months to sort out the problems he faces, which are considerable. And you should not expect him to keep you fully informed, more informed at all, about his actions. Why would an Archbishop talk further to somebody who goes to press with details of private conversations.

    I do not know DM and I am not a roman catholic. I read your blog with great interest but am concerned you are at times too quick to judge and at risk of spoiling the good work done by yourself.

    1. DM has had SEVEN YEARS to tackle the problems in his own cathedral!

      SEVEN YEARS !!!

      Thats some timescale!

    2. Yes, ++Martin contacted Pat for the info he was getting, but don't think for an instant it was because he wanted to do anything with it. The hierarchy for years have relied on people's natural confidence in authority figures, and people mistake a lack of action for workings behind the scenes.
      I'm much more surprised at +Pat wondering whether Rome has concerns about ++DM. Obviously nobody is interested,and Francis's regime is window dressing only. He has actively promoted men who covered up or engaged in child abuse and his mooted audit of the Vatican Bank was quashed.

  11. Many in Northern Ireland think Royality an unnecessary incumbency...so why on earth would we want a Roman Catholic prince
    You mean to tell me that the annual tripper to Lourdes and God knows where else is a supposed prince....he who asked children to keep stum without a parent present.....words fail me!!!!!!
    If I were advising DM I wd ask him to strip off all the purple and be a humble priest without trimmings.

  12. All this talk about red hats and bishops- boring stuff-

    Nobody is interested.

    Nobody cares.

    We have hit rock bottom.

  13. Students in Rome can use their time wisely or doss it away. Irish College is a living space rather than a primarily study environment. Built in prayer and grub for those who choose to attend. Sending a deacon to Rome for his last year could be a challenge unless he overcomes the language barrier. There is the angelicum uni which has an English language/American faculty. The opportunity to doss is real. Take it from one who knows

  14. Let's hope their samsungs don't go on fire then as they spend time on here
    They are the Italians ever ready to blog...
    Nite time prob a different story.

  15. Haha! Good response @12.04

  16. Does Diarmuid Martin not have an ex Maynooth seminarian as his private secretary?

    How many bishops have ex seminarians as their secretary?

  17. I disagree, Francis has done a lot to promote the plight of the outcast. He has given red hats to poor bishops rather than powerful cardinals. It all takes time. Wait and see.

  18. Surely he can have who ever he wants to be his private secretary?

  19. Dermo is never going to be made a cardinal and, when he retires in a few years, he will NOT be wanted in Rome. He will quietly go off into oblivion - his opportunistic career of political conniving over.

  20. 12.28 your drone is on target!

  21. Tell us more.

    Or at least tell Pat more.

  22. What do they say- a dead duck or lame duck or something?

  23. ++DM will probably never get a red hat. I think it's questionable as to whether ++EM will get one either. I think Francis will see through the Irish Church, not because it has been bad but because it just does not conform to his notion of what the Church is there for. The Irish Church and its bishops and so many of its priests are concerned with themselves and their own fate rather than being active about the business of the Gospel - and for Francis, that reads justice, the marginalised, the suffering, simplicity of life, being open and embracing to all....etc. Until the Irish Church makes a step change in its priorities, Francis will bypass it with red hats and won't waste his time on it.

    The Irish Church's self-indulgence in so many things stands in start contrast to the sacrificial concerns of the Church in so many other parts of the world. That list of new cardinals speaks volumes about the real Church - places like Syria, Albania, Central African Republic - where witness, sacrifice and martyrdom are the life of the Church. Where do you find that in Ireland ? Rather, in Ireland, you find a Church that is concerned with structures, with hierarchy, with maintaining the status quo even as the ship sinks beneath it.

    The Irish Church has been humbled by the abuse scandal. But, has it learned any lessons ? Maybe it needs to die out so that it can be reborn again ?

  24. Where do you see signs of their "humility"?

  25. 13.55 should have said ...the Irish hierarchy got a slap on the face, but being the hard nuts that they are , they blamed the scandal on thier victims and moved priests around .... They should always be reminded of that
    The Irish church does not deserve forgiveness it needs to keep repenting...instead of covering up their unsuitable seminaries

  26. Very clear analysis- The Church may not have the power and influence that it once yielded in this country. But maybe there is still more for it do to. The Countries you mentioned that got the red hat for the first time are visible signs of the church suffering. By giving the red hat to these countries Francis is making it very clear that what is asking is for a humble church that reaches out to people on the margins. That is Jesus always went. Maybe in Ireland we lost sight of that and, as you pointed out we are still at the level of structures and power.
    There is a line in a hymn that reads something like, unless a grain of wheat should die.......

  27. DM should be working towards getting Pat Buckley back into the fold
    We all should pray for that
    That doesn't mean I think highly of Roman Catholicism, it just means that he should never have been put outside the fold
    Back in 85 I had no interest in church matters...so I only know what I read on the web now.

  28. Maybe that was the real purpose of the call-
    What do you think, Pat?
    Would you go back?

    1. There were a number of calls and a greater number of emails.

      As a Christian we must ALWAYS be open to reconciliation with those from whom we are estranged. So of course I am open.

      In fact I tried petitioning for reconciliation several time and got doors closed on me - the last being 3 ago through the offices of a monsignor canob lawyer.

      A reconciliation between myself and the Church would be difficult for both sides.

      But I am open.

      Of course all true reconciliations should involve two "winners" and not one winner and one loser.

      True reconciliations are never about "defeat" but about mutual coming together.x

  29. Bishop Pat has a lot of gifts to offer the Church but if you ask me he needs to go to Pope Francis. He's the man in charge and he's the person who can sort things out. There is no point dealing with them on this side of the mountains.

  30. What makes you think DM won't get a red hat because he will be retired in 3 years? Had you looked closely at the newly appointed cardinals 2 or possibly 3 of the were emeritus bishops/archbishops, meaning they had retired.
    As for the grandeur of bishops. My aunt,a nun in England told me that when Cardinal Hume was out and about around his cathedral in London he would often were a simple habit as he was really a monk. She said he was wearing it in his coffin. Also there is another bishop somewhere in the north part of England who is also a monk and he goes about often wearing a habit with his little skullcap. There was a photo of him in the Universe These men were not bothered about being " princes" of the church.

  31. Good man Pat, that's the spirit. I didn't know you tried recently- how did it go for you?
    Jesus had no winners or losers but accepted everyone.

    1. The monsignor canon lawyer had a meeting in Maynooth with Bishop Noel Treanor.

      Treanor never got back to him or me.

      Treanor has refused to even meet me for 8 years since he came.

  32. I admire Pat Buckley's integrity. Did you see him on the BBC on Sunday night. Good stuff.

    If I were The Hierarchy I would prefer to have Pat in the tent pissing out than outside the tent pissing in :-)

    PP Derry.

  33. That is shocking, no word from Bp Treanor- Did you feel hurt?

    I could say worse things but I would prefer not to, I am a God-fearing Christian.

    1. Hurt would not be the word.

      Disappointed maybe.

      I have tried reconciliation with the three last bishops of Down and Connor - Daly,Walsh and Treanor.

      The one with Walsh was at his request.

      It seems power, anger and pride are blocking movement.

  34. I also meant to say- do you know of anyone else in a similar situation to yourself, Pat.
    Someone who is hoping for a reconcillation with the the Church and getting no where.?

    1. Fr Des Wilson of Belfast succeeded as did Fr Michael Keane of Tuam.

      By the way I wrote to Popr Francis and got no reply even though I sent a copy to the nuncio.

    2. A perfect example of Pope Francis being business as usual.

  35. Thanks for sharing your spiritual thoughts, much suits a Cleric better, before anyone shouts that's my opinion. Hope to read more of this Bishop Pat.

    1. I was waiting to see if abyone noticed.

    2. Respect and credit when due. Hope to read more reflections, I do think it reaches out to a wider audience and shows you at your best.
      I'm a stark believer in looking to the future and somewhat moving on from the past.
      We all have gruges and baggage from the past that can only serve to weigh ones good soul down.
      Thanks again.

  36. Have you tired going to speak with other bishops? Did I hear you saying you spent time as a priest in Wales? That might be an option. Sometimes there is more openness thar lár?
    A fresh start.

    1. We need to settle our problems here at home.

      Its time we stopped sending "problem" priests and OUR WOMEN to England :-)

  37. We just have to start using people power
    We have used it b4 and yes it is working
    All in good time....wish you had those emojis thingies Pat so I cd put up a nose

    Whenever anyone wants to start a "" people power '' I'm on board for pat
    Sure bishop trainor or has no power whatsoever.
    But we will expect a tip and poss a brown envelope
    So start now pat
    No more sugar
    Get out walking
    We want no big bellied returners

  38. Yes I watched a programme about basil Hume, he talked about himself
    I was very inspired by him
    Lovely monk....

  39. Saluti fraterni da Roma, Patricio! You began the day with a series of questions about Archbishop Diarmuid Martin and whether he had bona fides as a champion of justice and transparency.

    Based on a reading of yesterday's forensic examination of just his pussylike toying with Maynooth's acceptability - Will I take my three boys out or won't I [okay, just for the moment!]? Will I put them back in very soon [course I will, silly!]? Will I seek any changes in Maynooth [no!]? Will I seek to make common cause with other similar complainants [course I won't silly boy!]? Am I aiming to be the patron saint of whistleblowers [don't forget the whistle!]?

    Based on that reading I would say, Patricio, no - he is no champion of justice and transparency.

    But he gave you and many other people the fine sounding words that he indeed was going to champion changes in Maynooth - never gonna happen - and/or that he was going to root out scandalous behaviour emanating from his very own parish house namely the Pro-Cathedral and has he done so since he kicked out John Fla and installed Damien O'Reilly and entourage? Don't think so.

    All of the pictures you've posted and all of the details you've posted of Grindr activities and all of the scandalous example given by middle-aged priests who should know better when it comes to showering young seminarians with gifts, clothes, shared holidays, cash and cars - all of your publicising of this boundaries-smashing behaviour which would not be tolerated in any other organisation, Dear Diarmuid has cemented in during the past 7 years with two fingers up to all of the complainers.

    What has he done when people have sat opposite him telling long tales of woe (and when he has milked them of all possible information)?

    Absolutely nothing.

    What has he done when people have sent him detailed letters of complaint (giving him all of their information)?

    Absolutely nothing.

    What has he done when you have accepted his calls and emails (enabling him to extract from you the information more about YOU than about your complaints)?

    Absolutely nothing.

    Does Maynooth have anything to fear from our fearless reformer?

    Absolutely nothing. He's playing the game at least for the moment.

    Does the Pro and anyone in it have anything to fear from your fearless reformer?

    Absolutely nothing to fear.

    Do you have anything to fear from his contacts with you?

    Absolutely everything.

    He will take you down if he can and sleep fearlessly same night.

    Noi non lo vogliamo a Roma. È possibile tenerlo.

    [We don't want him in Rome! You keep him!]

    1. I think you know Diarmuid well - and from painful experience.

      Luckily for me he has nowhere to bring me "down" to.

    2. Which is exactly the position of the anawim, the poor, in scripture. Not only are they especially beloved of the Lord but are in a specially privileged position to speak the truth.

  40. Today is the feast day of Pope St John XXIII

    This is what the President of America at the time said of him:
    His Holiness, Pope John XXIII. He was a man of simple origins, of simple faith, of simple charity. In this exalted office he was still the gentle pastor. He believed in discussion and persuasion. He profoundly respected the dignity of man. He gave the world immortal statements of the rights of man, of the obligations of men to each other, of their duty to strive for a world community in which all can live in peace and fraternal friendship. His goodness reached across temporal boundaries to warm the hearts of men of all nations and of all faiths".

    This is the kind of pastor we need in the Church.

  41. For goodness sakes get a grip all you that are posting about red hats and the future of DM
    He is an oap, whether he likes it or not
    Yes he might live to be 95, but looking at him I doubt it
    He and the other hierarchical oaps need to sort out any wrong doing that they have inflicted on the church, the church's people and give a transparent account of their stewardships before it's too late

  42. In view of the comments from Rome at 16:28 - the question is being posed by commenters on this blog - Is DM compromised himself?

    To allow a deacon to proceed, who is alleged to have been engaged in activities described here over recent months, makes absolutely no sense. It is scandalous and has the potential for future scandal and damage to the Church (ie. Rory Coyle).

    To be aware of irregularities in the Pro (middle-aged priests making tools of themselves with young seminarians and a non-seminarian young organist) - and to do nothing about it - is inexplicable.

    Pretending to care, when, in reality, you quite frankly don't five a fiddler's f***, is crassness to the extreme.

    Is Dublin diocese in moral and spiritual meltdown?

    What's the story, Diarmuid?

  43. Cardinal Sean O Malley out of Boston always wears his brown habit - he is a simple man true and true.

    On Cardinal Hume - he was a good monk - Yes he was buried with his monks simply clothing - he never wanted to be Archbishop of Westminister - he asked the Pope on a number of occasion if he could retire back to Ampleforth but was not allowed. Very inspiring mind - much like Dessie O Connell - NOT !!!

  44. 18.16 yes I do believe he is comprimized. I put a.post on here this morning saying I believe DM has been threatened or blackmailed after going public with the Gaynooth stuff.

  45. I am just in from my evening Mass. I have to give you my thoughts, Pat, my son.

    There is a privileged clerical circle in each diocese it seems to me wherein priests, deacons and even some seminarians can do no wrong and will never be cast out regardless of their actions or inactions. They are destined to surround and adorn the holy episcopal throne and to take their monsignorial titles therefrom with ease. They are servants whom the bishop loves.

    Outside that privileged circle wallows the lower order of priests, those not subject to perennial favours from the episcopal tit and who are not loved but merely tolerated. Many priests from humble backgrounds, without monied families and without intellectual or theological brilliance - not art dealers or composers - these must feast only on the crumbs of rare comfort falling from the fine tables adorning the episcopal palace. Any and all minor wrongs by this lower caste will be held against their preferment for life. They will be judged and found wanting and dumped in the parishes - let's be honest - no one would want and which should really go to newly ordained wannabees who must make their mark. For senior priests to be returned to Go as it were and dumped back into these is punitive indeed.

    Outside that outer circle of hell are the absolute castouts and you, Pat, are on of these, latterly in part by your own choosing. You didn't come from money. You are not, let's be honest, a leading church intellect or theologian, though quick-witted.

    You were never at the very centre of the golden circle and so your blood is not blue of nature and so to be returned to trust, pension and preferment will take some years of penance - public and much publicised on afternoon chat shows if Brian Darcy will move over and let you onto them - and the certain repudiation of your episscopacy and your 'marriage'. Then and only then - and that will be around the year 10,000 - will you be brought back into the holy fold from whency you came.

    Alternatively, if you had something on one of them, you wouldn't have been cast out ever in the first place.

    And may God have mercy on your soul you reprobate you!

  46. I have great respect for +Archbishop D Martin - he took a stand against Maynooth and got no support from his brother bishops. Every hard to do something when you are isolated. The vultures in the Bishops conference are after him - maybe it is that +DM has stuff on them and they are trying to stop him.
    It might help if more humble bishops were appointed in Ireland who could work with +DM in cleaning the place up. Charlie Brown's recommendations for the vacant sees that have arisen have been some of the worst ever - careerists arse lickers and bag men with no smell of the sheep about them

    1. He took no stand at all 20:45. He's an actor and not a very good one. His faux outrage was another one of his cunning stunts!

  47. 20.45 He took the appearance of a stand against Maynooth you mean surely? Gorgeous is now Gorgeous Trastevere!

  48. @20:45.
    +DM would be happy to read your comment. Once it became clear that the story was to break he reacted well by courting the media, issue bland statements about 'strange goings on' and hope for a charitable interpretation from the pews.

    Now for a critical interpretation. What he really did was just move students to Rome. There is no need for Georgeous to be in any seminary, he could complete his theology studies in any Dublin University offering a Theology course while living and ministering in a parish. The effect of what +DM has done is taken a very risky student and expose an entirely new bunch of seminarians to his influence.

    Does he genuinely want reform? Well I wrote to him in 2009 about 'strange goings on' in Maynooth. 7 years later I have yet to receive a reply, although I have a confirmation that it was discussed with him. +DM has no interest in reforming Maynooth, strange clerical practices or the need for certain celibates to attend STD clinics.

  49. @21:13 - there is no need for "Gorgeous" to be in any seminary - PERIOD!!!

    He should be OUT ON HIS EAR!!

    It is absolutely shocking that this individual is not expelled and dismissed from the clerical state.

    He is a present scandal and future disaster!

    His continuance is sending all sorts of red alarm signals and some of them are now flashing around the archbishop of Dublin himself!!!

  50. He certainly won't be ministering in any parish 21. 13... Never, not in Ireland
    I put a post on this morning sking if D M is also gay?, don't know why it wasn't published

  51. If Gorgeous is merely sowing wild side oats for a few years and in the proper circles, and if Diarmuid can put up with that, why can't all of you? He'll settle down in due course.

    1. Just like Rory settled down you mean?? I'm sorry to have to tell you but "sowing wild oats" is not what Jesus envisages in those He calls to serve His people as priests.

  52. I believe Diarmuid Martin is gay and that's okay and if he sticks up for gays that's okay too. It redresses an imbalance elsewhere. Who cares anyway?

  53. I understood that seminarians were supposed to not be having sex if they expecting to be ordained priests
    Until the rc law changes that is what is expected of our rc priests
    You say sowing wild oats...I say being a hypocrite

  54. Why would anyone need D M to stick up for gays
    Gays are just people like those of us who are not gay...so we would expect D M to stick up for all people
    If you want to sow wild oats, you don't enter a people funded seminary...you work for a living.
    Then if you want to become a servant of God you have to undertake to obey the rules...or try and get the rules changed
    Pope Francis may just be the man to approach, but I don't think he has the authority to change much

    I don't care if D m is gay, but I do care if he is not doing his job

  55. To 15:13. You mentioned another bishop in England apart from the late Cardinal Hume who also wears his habit sometimes. That might be our bishop Michael Campbell. He is also a monk and used to teach here in Carlisle in the Austin Friars school. Lovely humble big Irishman. From Belfast I think

  56. @22:50 What? If a guy is 'sowing wild oats' in seminary, he is in the wrong place. Surely we can expect that men who are serious in their intent to be sexually continent should demonstrate, if only to themselves, that they can probably 'stay the course' well before they enter. If not, neither they nor those who will rely on their wisdom and maturity in future can have any confidence in them. I don't want a priest who might be more concerned about tonight's 'date' than bringing his people nearer to God. For goodness' sake if sex is more important to you than God and His people, you don't become a priest (unless you are spiritually suicidal).

  57. @22:17 from 21:13
    Georgeous is an active gay cleric of Dublin Diocese... Under the guidance of +DM he will minister in a Dublin parish, in fact he will probably spend a lot of time on his knees in a Dublin parish. Let's just hope he isn't the next appointee for a school chaplain's position. [personally I agree with the fact that he should be booted out of the clerical state, but I also don't see +DM actually doing this]. Reality is that Georgeous will probably be fine until +DM is replaced. Then all depends on who the new Archbitch is.

    Bishop Pat, aside from looking at who is surviving seminary to be ordained and who gets booted out (for being too holy, prayerful, kneeling in mass instead of the bedroom, being heterosexual or consciously objecting to seminarians having casual sex) perhaps a look at how many of the people ordained are lasting 5,10 years in ministry would be a good guide. I know that in recent years there has been a high rate of young clerics formed in Maynooth applying to leave the clerical state within a short period of ordination. There is also a bit of sabbatical going on with these fresh (but burnt out early clerics) I have also heard of three who have been in trouble with the gardai/psni already, but who remain in ministry under supervision.

    Maynooth is bad for the Church, bad for the men who go there and fail to give solid formation to those who get ordained on their recommendation.

    1. And the rate of attrition would be relatively easy to work out from published facts about ordinations, etc.
      The Boston Globe reporters discovered the proportion of priest abusers from those who were given specious forms of leave in the diocesan yearbook.

  58. And what about a certain monsenior giving Brendan Smyth
    His Christmas at home b4 jail
    And what did Brendan Smyth do
    Go up to the city and abuse a girl.