Monday, 22 May 2017

KERRY BANS SUNDAY FUNERALS



No exceptions to new diocesan regulation




Bishop Browne: no exceptions to regulation

SUNDAY funerals will no longer be allowed in the Diocese of Kerry, it has been decided.
Bishop Ray Browne has informed his priests that the new rule, which will apply from mid-afternoon on Saturdays until Monday mornings, will come into force on September 1 and it applies to Mass, liturgy and burials.
Removals to the church will be allowed on Saturday or Sunday evenings, however.
Bishop Browne said that he realises many people will have reservations about the decision but he stressed it was taken after extensive consultations with the laity and clergy throughout the diocese.
He said the change is necessary for many reasons, including factors in individual parishes and the availability of priests.
“Parishes are reminded that there be no exceptions to this diocesan regulation,” Bishop Browne stressed.
The new rule will also apply to St Patrick’s Day and, of course, Christmas Day.
“On the other holy days of obligation, for flexibility reasons, the decision is left to the local parish while discouraging such funerals for liturgical reasons,” the bishop added.

PAT SAYS:

Bishop Ray Brown of Kerry who is planning to ordain Deacon Sean "King Puck" Jones soon has banned Sunday funerals in Kerry.

Sunday funerals have been part and parcel of country life in Ireland since Adam was a boy.

He has taken this step without consulting the lay people of the diocese - the thousands of people who will be affected by his autocratic decision.

People are genuinely upset by this decision "from on high".

There is absolutely no reason why a funeral cannot take place at the Sunday Mass with burial afterwards in the nearby cemetery.

Neither do I see a problem with a priest putting on an extra Sunday Mass to facilitate the people who have been paying into their parishes and the diocese for centuries.

I Hope that the Kerry laity will not take this lying down.

AND:

IF ANY PERSON IN KERRY WANTS A SUNDAY FUNERAL AND THEIR LOCAL PRIEST REFUSES - JUST GET IN TOUCH WITH ME.

I WOULD BE QUITE HAPPY TO TRAVEL TO KERRY TO CELEBRATE A SUNDAY FUNERAL OR TO SEND ANOTHER PRIEST TO DO SO.


--------------------------------------------------

INDEPENDENT CATHOLIC CHURCH


One of the reasons we have launched the Independent Catholic Church is to give people an alternative place to go when dictatorial bishops and priests refuse to serve them as they should.

We can provide Catholic priests to conduct the weddings and funerals etc that the haughty RC guys refuse to do.

Just contact us at:  www.independentcatholicchurch.co.uk

Yesterday we added a NEW BLOG to the ICC website.
You can access it through the website home page or at:

independentcatholicchur.apps-1and1.net

39 comments:

  1. Just 'cos something is traditional does not mean it's a good idea. Priests are already run ragged servicing the existing Mass schedule, they often need to leave location A by a certain time in order to celebrate in location B. Asking them to cope with funeral rites on the same day just isn't fair. Neither is it fair to lay people have a family funeral imposed upon the regular Sunday Mass. In days before refrigeration, the indecent haste to get people buried in understandable. But times have moved on.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Irish priests run ragged!

      Nonsense.

      I could celebrate 6 Masses a day.

      What about family men who spend 8 and 10 hours on a building site.

      That's work!

      Delete
    2. How much would you charge?

      Delete
    3. Nothing. If the family wanted to give me a donation towards my travelling that would be fine.

      Delete
    4. I think the Bishop of Kerry is wise in this. Sunday funerals are not good pastorally, especially since they often conflict with the needs of the Parish as expressed in the Sunday Eucharist. I have never seen or heard of a Sunday funeral anywhere outside of Ireland, which is not justification enough to say that it should remain. In any case there are many parts of Ireland where this practice is not common. I tentatively suggest that this news may be used disengenously.

      Delete
    5. Run ragged? Irish clergy are hardly known to be Stakhanovite shock workers...

      TRS

      Delete
  2. And just where do you propose to celebrate such funerals you gombeen? The good people of Kerry would smell out a Ludramawn like you from miles away and your safety might be in jeopardy. So take my advice and keep your nose out of Kerry's business!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I've celebrated many weddings in Kerry - in people's homes, in hotels, in churches etc.

      Nothing wrong with a home funeral.

      The good people of Kerry are not violent.

      Anyway I would be there by invite.

      Delete
  3. I am tentatively agreeing with Ray Brown on this one while also saying no rule is written in stone and the exception may arise. As I recall an Irish RC funeral generally comes in two parts. Removal to Church and Mass the following day. As I also recall the removal to church always had a great "following". A short liturgy of the word followed by a long line of people shaking hands with the bereaved in the front seats. The mass the following day sometimes was the poor relation with a much smaller attendance-many may have been at work and of those who attended a proportion would not partake of communion. Here I see something of a dilemma - Mass without communion defeats the purpose. On a practical level we talk on here of separating church and state. Many state bodies do not work Saturday and Sunday so who will facilitate the burial. Again on a practical level many Irish funerals (in my time anyway) never arrived in church in reasonable time. (The same could be said of weddings). I suppose what I am asking really is if the modern Irish R C funeral liturgy is catechetically appropriate to the expectations of a modern not necessarily church literate family and the needs of a church challenged to make sense of and evangelise a modern Ireland and world

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I bet you there will be Sunday exceptions for the rich and famous.

      Delete
    2. As a wise poster said a few days ago---be careful what you ask for,in case you get it!

      Delete
    3. and that's for sure pat. Class distinction!

      Delete
    4. Most Kerry burials are facilitated by local grave diggers.

      Delete
  4. Why not put Deacon King Puck in charge of Sunday weddings?

    ReplyDelete
  5. Slightly off message but has anybody seen "The Keepers"the documentary series on Netflix about the murder of a young nun in the US nearly 50 years ago and the cover up of horrendous sexual abuse in a Catholic school?It is frightening and heartbreaking and well worth watching.If you haven't Netflix it is worth getting it for this alone .Anyway you can get a month's free trial without obligation .I spent the weekend watching this and I thought I was unshockable but I can't get it out of my head.And I have just read that the evil monster of a priest involved retired to Wexford!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Appreciate so much your honesty in saying "..but I can't get it out of my head."
      I certainly wouldn't like to be like that. It has happened to me enough times before, so I definitely won't be watching.

      Delete
    2. 11:21, yes, you're right about 'Keepers'. I watched all seven episodes on Netflix almost back-to-back.

      It's a compelling account; disturbing, too. Not just the alleged sado-sexual abuse by that priest, but the by-now-not-surprising protection he received from a Catholic hierarchy worshipping the Golden Calf of insitutional Roman Catholicism.

      Delete
  6. The claim that Irish Clergy are "run ragged" must be the biggest joke of the Century. They have little to do and overpaid for doing what little they do. Always moaning about their workload!! The Bishop of Kerry comes across as autocratic and arrogant. If Sean Jones gets Ordained that will be a great role model and advertisement for Kerry. God help us.

    ReplyDelete
  7. Unusual that yesterday's blog on Maynooth attracted so few comments.

    If it is true that the new Nuncio is being briefed to clean up the Irish problem, waiting three years until Diarmuid Martin retires, will only compound the damage that urgently needs to be averted now.

    DM came on to the Irish scene on a great white charger in 2003, to sort out clerical sexual abuse. He sounded to be making all the right noises - greatly helped by his friends in the media - who collaborated in the manufacturing of this person.

    DM last summer talked about "strange goings on" in Maynooth. A deacon of Dublin diocese was - and is - at the very centre of these "strange doings on".

    Everyone knows this man's identity and the story has been reported in the world press.

    It is incomprehensible that this matter has not been transparently addressed given the very public manner in which charges were made.

    If this deacon is innocent, if he has been set up by malicious persons, then he deserves to be exonerated and recompense made to him for all that he has unjustly suffered.

    Those responsible for any crime against him should be prosecuted.

    This - if the deacon is innocent - needs to be done for his own sake, as a matter of justice, and so that priests and laity can relate to him with complete confidence, in his future ministries.

    This has not happened. Why not?

    If this deacon is guilty of the behaviour of which he is accused, under no circumstances should he be ordained a priest. If he is guilty, he needs to be speedily laicised.

    If he is guilty and DM is intent upon ordaining him regardless, then there is cause for the gravest concern as to the suitability of Diarmuid Martin as archbishop of Dublin.

    If the deacon is a practicing and promiscuous homosexual and has been behaving in the scandalous manners alleged, for DM to ordain him would be as grave an act of irresponsibility as is possible for a Catholic bishop to commit. It calls into serious question Martin's sanity, his judgement, his ability to hold office.


    If this deacon is guilty, DM must be prevented by Rome from ordaining him. Rome, if it doesn't remove Martin from office, needs to impose safeguards and sanctions upon him, until his retirement in 2020.

    Is DM insane? Is he breathtakingly arrogant and wilful? Is he downright stubborn? Is it pridefulness that drives him? Is he compromised? Has he been up to "strange goings on" himself?

    All of the questions above and more, are circulating in view of the reports on this blog, since last year.

    The exact same holds true with regard to the Kerry deacon's situation.

    If these men are innocent they must be publicly vindicated. If they are not innocent, their priestly ordinations must never be allowed to take place. They will injure the Church and harm the Faith.

    Rome needs to be aware, for example, that young Catholics are reading this blog. I have been questioned about this blog by a 17year old boy who plays guitar in the folk group - a good kid - the sort of normal young man you would be glad to see involved in the parish.

    He knows some of the seminarians being talked about here through youth retreats. Some of these seminarians are involved in youth ministry and retreats. Our 17 year old was told about this blog by other young people on the retreat.

    So our young Catholics are aware of all this!!! This is an absolutely appalling vista. God help us if we imagine we are going to get holy vocations out of all of this!

    ReplyDelete
  8. Part 2.
    Is DM insane? Is he breathtakingly arrogant and wilful? Is he downright stubborn? Is it pridefulness that drives him? Is he sexually compromised? Has he been up to "strange goings on" himself?

    All the above questions and more, are circulating in view of the reports on this blog, since last year.

    The exact same holds true with regard to the Kerry deacon's situation.

    If these men are innocent they must be publicly vindicated. If they are not innocent, their priestly ordinations must never be allowed to take place. They will injure the Church and harm the Faith.

    Rome needs to be aware, for example, that young Catholics are reading this blog. I have been questioned about this blog by a 17year old boy who plays guitar in the folk group - a good kid - the sort of normal young man you would be glad to see involved in the parish.

    He knows some of the seminarians being talked about here through youth retreats. Some of these seminarians are involved in youth ministry and retreats. Our 17 year old was told about this blog by other young people on the retreat.

    So our young Catholics are aware of all this!!! This is an absolutely appalling vista. God help us if we imagine we are going to get holy vocations out of all of this!

    I am a priest in a different part of the country from Dublin and Kerry but this affects all of us. What could I say to our 17year old except to say that you find darkness in every walk of life. I should not have to be talking to a young man about whether or not bishops, priests and seminarians have been having gay sex with each other!!!

    This has been dragging on for a year now. The matter needs to cleared up. If bishops and seminary staff are sexually compromised then they need to be removed from office - no matter who they are. This needs to happen as soon as possible.

    PS. Yesterday someone raised an issue with regard to Clonfert and the possible appointment of man to that diocese opening a "Pandora's Box" etc.

    Would that person not give all his information to Pat and ask Pat to contact the person in question, telling him that xyz is known and for your own good - and the good of the Church - do not accept the appointment if it is offered to you, for you will be publicly exposed and have to resign.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. To 15.35
      In your post you very rightly give us an important reminder of our duty not to be a source of scandal to the impressionable young and that thought should be in the forefront of our minds when our fingers hit the keyboard to write a post. What sort of impression do we give to them or indeed anyone who comes across this blog? I shudder to think when I remember days when writers condemned the Church with the very worst words in their stomach! Everyone--everything sacred - every saint and struggling sinner - -all slashed down and condemned without any sense of balance or thoughtful discrimination. Haven't enough of our little ones been abused and scandalised! Isn't it also our duty to properly educate and encourage others and to try to be a source of light and strength?

      Delete
    2. 22:27, what sort of twisted and perverted creature are you, truly one wonders?

      Your honeyed words hiding a morass of the vilest evil in your black heart?

      Are you one of the Gaynooth deans, I wonder? Or a Grinding seminarian? Or one of their sugar daddies?

      "Light and strength"?? You are the worst kind of poisoner and apologist for wickedness. No doubt your father Lucifer is well pleased with you.

      Delete
    3. To 22:27 - what in the name of God are you talking about? You're one of them, aren't you?

      Delete
  9. "a practising and promiscuous homosexual" -- three homophobic words in one phrase!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Give us a break... They are not homophobic words. Whether or not you or I agree with it, a Roman Catholic priest (or deacon in this case) cannot be a practicing and promiscuous homosexual. A cleric promises celibacy at ordination and therefore to be a sexually active and promiscuous homosexual OR heterosexual is inappropriate.

      Delete
    2. Here's one more for you 'degenerate'.

      Delete
    3. 16:37 is crying "homophobia". This perfectly illustrates the gravity of the crisis we are facing.

      "Promiscuous" and "seminarian" do not belong in the same sentence. A promiscuous homosexual or heterosexual does not belong in priestly formation. What part of that do you not get 16:37?

      Even if there was no celibacy requirement for priests and deacons, these men having rampant sex would still need to be expelled from the seminary.

      As it is, as a priest, I could not with a clear conscience and easy mind, encourage any young man to become a seminarian for an Irish diocese at present.

      Do we want our young men going into an environment where there is an atmosphere of rampant promiscuity? Where prurient and dysfunctional "deans" will quiz them about their penile activity during sleep, etc? Where some leering senior cleric or even prelate will be eying them up like fresh meat?

      Furthermore, be assured, our young ones are talking about this. I know one boy in his late teens who has been on Youth 2000 retreats where some of these seminarians have also been and he has concluded from observing the antics and READING THIS BLOG that the best thing to do is avoid all of them like the plague.

      Yes, "Rome", if you are reading this, the young Catholics of Ireland, the few that we have left in the pews, are reading this blog. They know about the Grindr sems and priests. We are a laughing stock. So get it sorted!

      Delete
  10. I remember Ray Browne as a student and priest in Elphin. I recall him as a person with a level head who acted with integrity. I imagine he would be a man that goes by the book and dislikes negative publicity.

    ReplyDelete
  11. President Higgins will be dining in the irish college later, I wounder will the good deacon be around or will be put to bed early away from the cameras

    ReplyDelete
  12. PAT we need a blog about the western dioceses please 1

    ReplyDelete
  13. I would think the city parishes in each Diocese would be the Place where the boys are sent who are favourites to the Bishop in that particular Diocese. Everyone else thrown out of the public eye into the slums or countryside.

    ReplyDelete
  14. Now harry, I would love to be in the countryside

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Would highly recommend the BBC programme "Escape to the Country". I think you'd love it . ��

      Delete
  15. Whats the odds on Timmy barlett getting the nod after or before the world meeting of families? which diocese?

    ReplyDelete
  16. With this new Nuncio and Charlie Brown gone Timmie might just miss out!

    ReplyDelete
  17. Pat, I think the poster at 15:28 and 15:35 makes good points, particularly about Diarmuid Martin and Maynooth...and these observations are all the more relevant because the ordination class piece for 2017 has just been unveiled here in Maynooth!! Well, it wasn't really unveiled - it was put up on the wall very quietly...

    And guess who is on it?? Deacon Gorgeous!! So it seems very clear that DM intends to ordain him.

    This is the talk of the seminary at the moment...Even the deacons didn't want him on it, but the SEMINARY COUNCIL (i.e. Mullaney, Collins, Prior) decreed that his photo was to be put on it. Just in case anyone was thinking that things had changed here this year...

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Can you take a photo and send it to Pat to put up on the blog?

      Delete
  18. Timmy's ambition is all too obvious. Plus he was a christian brother for a spell - hardly a good recommendation. Also Amy doesn't care for him.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Bartlett is desperate to become a bishop. His associations with Brady might not help - the "wounded healer" gaffe.

      The dynamic and charismatic Kevin Doran got Elphin for his Eucharistic Congress performance. Lol. So possible Timo might get the nod. Doran speaks a few language other than English which was useful for an international event. Bartlett only speaks English which is surely a handicap in organising a World Meeting. Who knows? Who cares? Lol

      Delete