Tuesday, 1 August 2017

MESSAGE FROM GAY PRIEST



Dear +Pat,

I am a priest who is gay. I'm comfortable with who I am and how God created me. I was ordained in the mid 90's and based in a parish. I think the treatment of priests who are gay is deplorable in Church and your blog is probably the place where greatest hate to shown toward us. 

Growing up I was the victim of bullying. The scars still remain with me. The bullying of gay priests on this blog is beyond what is called for. 

Thankfully, the God I believe in a God of compassion. I reflect on the Gospel accounts of Jesus who supported the woman caught in adultery, of the Prodigal Father who rejoiced at the return of the Prodigal Son, of meeting Jesus in the least of our brothers and sisters. 

Fr Bernard Lynch has done great work in outreaching to gay people and meeting them where they are at and supporting them. 

+Pat, you have two options, you can continue to bully gay people or help them in their difficulties and their struggles. The choice is yours. 

Yours, 

Fr James.

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A COMMENT MAKER ANSWERS FATHER JAMES


"This so called "Fr" James does himself and others of his sex no favors with his pathetic and nauseating bleating against Pat Buckley. Typical "screaming queen" melodramatic nonsense.

Listen here "Fr" - you took vows. You are supposed to keep your penis to yourself - not broadcast it on the internet, etc. If you are not engaging in sinful activities like the characters exposed (pardon the expression) by Pat, then you have nothing to fear from him.

No one is interested in your gayness. You are not being persecuted. If you have a mutually respectful relationship with a significant other, Good luck to you! But keep it to yourself. We are not interested.

But if you go prowling on Grindr, etc. Or make a nuisance of yourself to young fellows, or shoot your sperm live on line. And all that sort of thing - that@s a different "Ball game" (once again excuse the expression) God did not "make" you go off and do carry on like that.

So cop on to yourself and dry your eyes and stop your silly, self-pitying clap trap. Martyrs you and your ilk ain't.

Keep up the good work Pat and ignore these "gay haters" attacking you. If it's not one thing it's another. They are probably the musical friends of the frauds and charlatans you are exposing in any case".

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PAT SAYS:

Father James, Thank you for your email and what I saw as your constructive criticism of me and the Blog.

This Blog DOES NOT attack gay priests. I know many dozens of gay priests who I never mention on this Blog. Some of them are celibate and some of them are in loving relationships with one other person.

I'm sure you yourself would distinguish between those priests and priests who seek promiscuous sex of gay apps and priests who display their genitals on cam and priests who masturbate on cam?


And then there is the other issue.

As a Roman Catholic priest, you are a representative of the Roman Catholic Church and its teachings. Two of those teachings are:

1. That sex outside of a man and woman valid marriage is a serious sin.

2. Homosexual acts are disordered and sinful.

How do you square being a public representative of a Church that teaches these things when you don't agree with them?

How do you square a gay priest being sexually active with the promise/vow you have made to that Church?

Is living a double life, not hypocrisy? 

Also, many of the priests dealt with on here are part of the clerical establishment who "lick" their way into positions and kiss the paws of their clerical overlords and at the same time have a double life in gay saunas, on internet apps and exposing themselves and masturbating on line from their presbyteries. 

Maybe it's time gay priests who want to be sexually active made a choice - between priesthood in a gay condemning Church and having a gay lifestyle either inside or outside a gay marriage.

Maybe you cannot have it both ways.

AND - there are Churches, including my own Oratory Society, who allow priests, straight and gay to be both priests and have sexual intimacy.

It is not homophobia to say that celibacy professing priests having sex is a massive contradiction.

Is it not a case of pissing or getting off the pot?





46 comments:

  1. The thing is, priests have been having it both ways for so long it has become a typical pattern of behaviour.

    For example, Keith O'Brien admitted being active his entire career, even groping a priest at a party on the day he was conferred as a cardinal.

    It's only now with the advent of the internet that, finally, a spoke can be put in their wheel.

    ReplyDelete
  2. The attempt to have a constructive conversation on this issue is defeated by what passes for a contribution after Fr James' piece. It's not rational, respectful or reasonable.

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    Replies
    1. The contribution after "Fr" James' piece is spot on! It tells it like it is and speaks for many like me who are sick and tired of these inexcusable antics of some clergy.

      Absolutely ridiculous to read the likes of you at 8:08, clutching your pearls in horror at a bit of straight talking.

      Let's remember what is at issue here: clergy engaging in public indecency; clergy romantically pursuing teenage boys; clergy trawling the internet for sex.

      The contributor who wrote yesterday in response to the whinging, self pitying "Fr" James, speaks for many people weary of these disgusting spectacles.

      You 8:08 need to examine your conscience and stop excusing the inexcusable.

      I want my teenage sons to have a positive, life-enhancement, spiritually healthy experience of the Church. I don't want them 'perved' over by some cleric and, if they go to something like World Youth Day, that they come home happy, having enjoyed it, with their peers, cared for by decent and true priests.

      And their underpants in my washing machine where they belong!!!

      Mother, Co Armagh.

      Delete
    2. This priest did not state that hevwas sexually active (and, therefore, in breach of his promise of celibacy).

      Curb your ire.

      Delete
    3. No, but he is whinging that those who are sexually active and in breach of their promises are being "persecuted"! Curb your own ire to which have been exposed on this blog more times than can be counted.

      Delete
    4. The Armagh Mother makes very good points and she said nothing about this Fr James being sexually active.

      So you wind your neck in MC and don't be starting your usual old nonsense today again.

      "Curb your ire"??? Rich coming from you!

      Delete
    5. 16:05, I think he's 'whinging' (your word) about the treatment of gay people in general (not just celibate gay priests), but I don't believe he is defending gay priests who breach their promises/vows of celibacy; re-read the penultimate sentence of his e-mail. And he has a point. The constant carping about sexually active gay priests is a broad and indiscriminate brush, and gay people in general (including good, celibate gay priests) will, inevitably, be tarred with it. (In fact, many have: gay men have, at the highest level in the Church, been barred from entering seminary.)

      16:52, she may not have said as much, but she, like you and 16:05, have misconstrued his point as a defence of promiscuous priestly gay behaviour.

      If I am wrong about this, then Fr James can correct me.

      Delete
  3. This is the most straightened and common sense talking I have seen on here for a long time. P or get off the pot. The only factor not mentioned is the A P factor. Those who leave may feel the effect in the Arse Pocket. Loss of pounds or euros . This bit is genuinely scarey.

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  4. Typical "poor me" clerical response that grasps the wrong end of the stick. Pats blog when it relates to specialised behaviours seeks to expose and condemn casual sex not gay sex. Clerics miss that point because they can't take criticism constructively.

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    Replies
    1. Yes, but surely as a consequence of all the attention that this blog seeks to direct on those who (arguably) deserve it, it's not unreasonable that those who may not are feeling uncomfortable.

      Delete
    2. 8.20 You are so right. Some cant

      Delete
  5. Pat, your analysis of the situation leaves out one major consideration. It's a sociological one. It's the idea of slow change from within a system over a long time. The numerical dominance of gay clergy is the case in point.

    Who would have thought the referendum would have enjoyed the support of such a majority of Irish people!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. A very good point.

      However,even with sociological achange will Catholic Christianity say it is a good thing for priests to masturbate on line?

      A gay priest in a loving relationship is a white horse of a different colour.

      Delete
    2. Yes. I agree that it is a different matter, as you say.

      But it's more complex than the way you put it.

      While slow change from within may be, and actually, is taking place, it may not be quick enough for some people. It may be easier in a generation. That isn't much consolation for those of this generation. And so you are going to have people dealing with the frustration in unhelpful and unhealthy ways. For that reason, I don't approve of your approach in relation to the priest whose actions you exposed.

      Delete
  6. Who is Fr Bernard Lynch?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Irish priest wrongly accused of trying to seduce a boy in New York who has had a decades long ministry to gay people in London.

      A good man. A friend of mine.

      Delete
  7. I think that the blog has taken on a new and healthy approach today and that is one of dialogue. This is what is lacking within the Church and the lbgt community in Ireland. Maybe it is happening in other Christian Churches, I am not too sure.
    In fairness to James and to Pat you respected each other's views. You both allowed each other the freedom to speak.
    I think a number of people has called for this blog to give expression to different points of view, different outlooks and we have hold a divergence of views. Wouldn't it be great to see if a lay gay Catholic might write in about his/her experience about being gay?

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  8. 9.09 People like Fr Lynch need to be highlighted. There are genuine victims in all of this.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I agree with you Sean. I don't know much about him. He seems to have suffered a lot. Maybe you could tell us more about him.

      Delete
    2. Lynch holds doctorates in psychological counselling, and theology.

      He is in a long-term relationship (more than twenty years) with his male partner.

      Delete
  9. I would like to hear more about Fr Lynch and his experience Pat from your knowledge of him. Perhaps, you might tell his story in a blog.

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  10. If we believe some progress is being made in our thinking about and understanding of being gay, Church thinking and gay clergy, it is important that we don't use language that incites hatred towards certain individuals. Reasoned, rational and intelligent comment helps. So Pat, please have less of the hate filled anti clergy brigade and more of balanced debate. Please encourage this approach. Whoever we are we all need support and understanding in our struggles. Sometimes we inherit a baggage which is difficult to unload.

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  11. Is Fr Bernard from Longford ?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I think he might be from Limerick. We'll claim him for the Treaty City. Limerick PP

      Delete
  12. Thank God for the gift of the internet. It's a two edged sword for sure, but at least it's allowing the truth to get out. Whitewashing no longer works. The great institutions,be it church or media, no longer have a monopoly on controlling information output.Thank God for that and for true democracy, not the top down kind that has brainwashed us for too long. The truth shall set you free.

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  13. Bernard Lynch is a wonderfully liberated man. Not speaking for him and I doubt he would see himself as a victim. Thru his counselling practice he helps people liberate themselves from shackles wherever they exist and come from. He's one of the good guys. A man living in reality.

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  14. Anon at 8.20am. I have no fear of criticism but I won't tolerate words and language that incite hatred towards priests. A rational, compassionate, intelligent discussion needs to take place around Catholic moral teaching on sexuality but throwing in hate filled and contemptible language is counterproductive. Some bloggers are emotionally intelligent - you are not one of them. So, cease your hate mongering. Learn a little psychology and you'll be much wiser and enlightened.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. And you, anon @ 13:55, strike me, as one observing this exchange, as every bit as "hate filled", "contemptible", emotionally unintelligent and intolerant as the person you are criticising. But you are too myopic to even notice - aren't you?

      Delete
    2. Anon at 15.38. You found a new word - myopic - well done!! Sorry you feel stung by my contribution but if you are intelligent, you couldn't in conscience approve of certain narratives on this blog. They regularly incite hatred towards priests. I would never approve of such towards any person, irrespective of who they are. I utterly reject and condemn all abuse and wrongdoing but the level of nasty vitriol against clerics is hate filled. You seem one who foments such behaviour.....

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    3. I'm not "stung" by anything let me assure you :-)

      Incitement of "hatred" against priests? Really? Where?

      All I can see is justified anger and understandable outrage, against those clerics who are masturbating on the internet and generally living lives unworthy of their calling, to put it mildly!

      Delete
    4. Anon at 18.26: you have difficulty in recognising the absence of truth, justice and fairness. You are not worthy of intelligent debate. You are crass.....I dare suspect your life is shining brightly! Now to be balanced, rational and fair.....a hard task for you but comes with practice.....

      Delete
    5. @13.55 I am emotionally intelligent at times. I do not support name calling in responses to pat's blogs but the point remains - Pat criticises casually sexually active priests regardless of orientation.

      I am sensitive to the fact that this predominantly concerns homosexual sex and criticism of a gay cabal. I am also sensitive to the fact that the homosexuals in Maynooth bullied me because I was not gay and so I was out of place.

      If you have a problem on the blog than reply. Your post is equal to any others. But if you're heterosexual and bullied in Maynooth than you bet the directors of formation will bully you to your face and wield their power as decision maker - great psychological abuse there. So please forgive me if name calling on a blog which can simply be ignored by people who don't like it is not massive on my empathy priorities today.

      Delete
  15. I I have to admit, depsite the laughable levels of heresy and confusion, this blog is very funny! GG EZ

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    Replies
    1. Have you started your homework?

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    2. My thoughts exactly Magna! haha

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    3. I am sure the likes of Martin, Coyle, and McCamley, etc. are also laughing... and I don't think.

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    4. Pseudo psychologists, amateur historians and highly confused wannabe theologians, it all adds up to what makes for fun reading. Even you magna and your drink fuelled rants are laughable! Peace out!

      Delete
    5. Pat, the exchanges between some bloggers is becoming tedious and tiresome. You shouldn't allow such individuals to hijack spaces with their nonsense. Keep having a balance in exchanges as it enables more enlightened debate. All of us require help and assistance in our different struggles. That some clerics, like you Pat, struggle with their sexuality surely warrants a compassionate response. Obviously any deviancy and abuse is repugnant and deserves condemnation but those who are genuinely good people and coming to terms with their own reality should be respected, not ridiculed and subject to horrible venom.



      Delete
  16. Anon at 14.39 - Confusion, error, premature judgments, venom, poisonous rants, incitement to hatred, heresy, crass ignorance - you'll find a happy mix of all of these and other unsavoury ingriedients on this blog. Funny - not so sure!! No real, visionary or imaginative leadership shown by its creator!

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  17. Anonymous at 14.39
    I suspect when you say heresy, you intend to be derogative. It doesn't follow however.

    Heresy is the synthesis which almost made it, but not quite. Heresy is always necessary to ensure the orthodox synthesis is real.

    What would be interesting and indeed helpful would be if you could point out some of the examples of the level of heresy you detect here. That would encourage clarity of thought all around.

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    Replies
    1. Derogatory I meant.

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    2. Indeed ---presumably starting with an increase in your clarity of thought perhaps?

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    3. Yes. Self-reflection does that.

      Delete
  18. Very Christian and mature approach to this subject of a person's sexuality on today's blog.
    As many people have already said I would like to see more dialogue in an open and honest forum rather than name-calling and back biting.
    Hopefully we'll see more of this in the future.
    Peace.

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  19. @13.53 I thought you expressed one of the nicest quotes I ever heard about another human being- 'A man living in reality'. He must have come through a lot of deep struggles and difficulties in his life. I can't say I know the man at all but he seems to be an inspiration to many.
    There is a lovely calmness and gentleness about today's blog.

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  20. A lot of problems with your website today Pat. Comments not getting through.

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