Friday, 25 August 2017

Papal abuse commission considers removing abuse survivors!
ROME — Pope Francis' commission on clergy sexual abuse is considering whether to restructure itself so that it no longer includes the direct participation of abuse survivors. It is evaluating the possibility of creating instead a separate advisory panel of individuals who have been abused by clergy.
A member of the Pontifical Commission for the Protection of Minors revealed the group's consideration of the idea in an NCR interview Aug. 14, saying that one of the commission's work groups has been tasked with weighing the pros and cons of such a change.
The commission appears likely to discuss the possible restructuring at its next plenary meeting in Rome in mid-September, when the original three-year terms of its members are set to expire.
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"I think that may be a more productive [way] of ensuring the voice of survivors in the work of the commission," Krysten Winter-Green, the commission member, said of the potential change. "I do not know that it's critical that a survivor needs to be actually on the commission."
"No decision has been made about this," she stressed, adding: "I think the voice of survivors needs to be heard by this commission. They need to have input into every facet of the operation. How that is accomplished remains to be seen, but it will be accomplished."
Consideration of a change in structure for the papal commission comes as the group has in recent months faced public questioning of its effectiveness in stopping future abuse of children and vulnerable people in the Catholic Church. The group now appears to be in the midst of a significant phase of transition.
Six months ago, the commission lost its last active member who was an abuse survivor. Marie Collins resigned March 1, citing frustration with Vatican officials' reluctance to cooperate with the group's work.
While it appears likely Francis will reappoint most of the commission following conclusion of their three-year terms in September, member Jesuit Fr. Hans Zollner said in June he expects the composition of the membership may change.
Collins, an Irishwoman, was one of two survivors originally appointed to the commission. The other, Englishman Peter Saunders, was placed on leave from the group in February 2016 because of friction between Saunders and other members of the group.

'Acknowledgment of their failure'
Winter-Green, a native New Zealander who lives in the U.S. and provides consulting services to dioceses and religious congregations, did not detail exactly how the papal commission and a possible new survivors' advisory panel might function together.
Several national bishops' conferences have developed safeguarding entities and survivors' panels that could be used as models for the potential restructuring. The bishops' conference of England and Wales, for example, has a National Catholic Safeguarding Commission that receives counsel from a Survivor Advisory Panel.
The website for that panel describes its role as "to ensure that the National Catholic Safeguarding Commission receives appropriate and timely information and advice from a survivor perspective."
Survivors and survivor advocates were critical of the idea of keeping survivors off of the papal commission in favor of a separate advisory panel.
Peter Isely, a founding member of the Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests and the group's former Midwest director, said he would see such a shift as part of a desire to keep the papal commission free of conflict.
"There are thousands and thousands of survivors and many of them are public," said Isely. "If you cannot manage to directly bring in survivors ... to the commission, you're just putting the discussion and conflict aside."
Isely noted that the commission itself does not have any rule-making power as it relies on the pope to either accept or reject its recommendations. He said that makes the commission one-step removed from rule-making power, and would thus make any new advisory panel two-steps removed from such power.
"To make it two-removed, to make it advisors to advisors, is just an acknowledgement of their failure," he said.
"It's just pushing the issues that were unresolved from the three years ... one removed down," said Isely. "It's not a solution. It's making it more difficult to get to the solution, in my opinion."
Dominican Fr. Thomas Doyle, an expert on the church's response to clergy sexual abuse, was biting in his assessment of the idea.
"After three years, I'm not sure that they've done anything that's really meaningful."
—Fr. Thomas Doyle

Image result for father tom doyle
"What would they do?" he asked about the possibility of a new advisory panel. "Would they have any power? Would they have any influence? Would anyone listen to them? Would they just be a panel that exists in name only?"
"It sounds to me as if that idea is something that was conjured up to make the appearance that they're taking it seriously and doing something, while in fact it's simply another smoke and mirrors production," said Doyle.
Francis created the pontifical abuse commission in December 2013 at the recommendation of his advisory Council of Cardinals. The pope appointed the first members to the new commission, including its president, Boston Cardinal Sean O'Malley, on March 22, 2014.
The commission's statutes, available online, were approved in April 2015 by Vatican Secretary of State Cardinal Pietro Parolin. They state that the group is to continue on ad experimentum for three years, after which time it is to present any possible modifications to its operating procedures to Francis for approval.
Doyle and Isely were both also critical about the overall work of the commission and what it has accomplished since Francis first created the group.
Doyle said bluntly: "After three years, I'm not sure that they've done anything that's really meaningful."
The priest said that Collins' resignation and the statement she wrote for NCR at the time explaining her decision to leave the commission had been the "most effective action" to come out of the group.
"The one thing I think this point in the history of the commission proves very clearly is the lack of a commitment by the Holy See to effectively deal with the issue of child abuse by clergy," he said.
In her NCR statement March 1, Collins wrote about several instances of her frustration with Vatican officials' reluctance to work with the commission.
Collins said her resignation was immediately precipitated by one Vatican office's refusal to comply with a request from the commission, approved by the pope, that all letters sent to the Vatican by abuse survivors receive a response.
Isely said it was "most distressing" that the two survivors who had originally been appointed to the commission have now left active membership.
"You could not get a more qualified, reasonable, thoughtful and experienced survivor on that commission than [Marie Collins]," he said. "For her to lose hope ... is an extremely significant statement about the commission."
Mentioning Collins' revelation of difficulty getting Vatican officials to respond to survivors' letters, Isely asked: "If the pope can't even get that done, what else is he really going to be able to do?"
'There's just not adequate resources'
Winter-Green, who holds a doctorate in pastoral psychology and three master's degrees in theology, human development, and social work, pointed to other areas where the commission has had success. She said the group has done a lot of work educating church leaders in different parts of the world on how to best prevent abuse.
She cited numbers indicating that between 2015 and July 2017 commission members or their staff had given 110 presentations on abuse prevention in 45 countries.
"One of the quintessential goals that was decided when we first came together was the critical need for education," said Winter-Green.
"There continues to be a tremendous misunderstanding or ignorance about the serious moral and psychological harm done to children and vulnerable adults," she said. "There's a need for a changing of attitudes, particularly among the hierarchy."
The commission member also cited the success the group had in suggesting that Francis create a day of prayer in the church for survivors of abuse, which the pope approved.
"You can readily understand what a matter of frustration it is that everything moves so slowly at the Vatican."
—Krysten Winter-Green
Winter-Green said the commission's theology and spirituality work group is now working on a liturgy of healing that can be used around the world. "I think it's tremendously important that this happens and that it happens at the local level," she said.
"The church has looked at past abuse from a legal and financial perspective, largely ... but victims and survivors mostly want to be heard and believed," Winter-Green continued.
"It's my personal opinion that the church needs to front up to this," she said. "It needs to make this acknowledgment in a quintessentially pastoral and spiritual sense. It's the way that the wounds can be addressed."
While Winter-Green pointed to some of the commission's successes, she also reinforced some of the criticisms Collins had made in her March 1 statement about working with Vatican officials and the lack of resources and staffing made available to the group.
Winter-Green said part of the difficulty in making the commission effective has been learning to deal with the slow and sometimes inefficient work processes employed at the Vatican.
At the root of the issue, she said, is learning how to work effectively within the system.
"The Vatican doesn't work at any great speed of light," said Winter-Green. On the commission, she said, are "some highly qualified, professionally trained, thoughtful, wise and eloquent individuals. And you can readily understand what a matter of frustration it is that everything moves so slowly at the Vatican."
"It just doesn't happen overnight," she said. "Perhaps over a few months, if you're lucky. That's the way it is."
"One has to be aware of that and learn to work within that system," Winter-Green added. "Because otherwise you get nowhere."
Her group is understaffed and overworked, she said, adding that she spends about four to five hours per day on commission work for an average of five to six days a week.
"We have a horrendous job and a very slim budget," said Winter-Green. "The lack of transparent information regarding budgetary resources" was a "major challenge" facing the commission, she said.
"We're under-resourced in terms of having professionally prepared people who can manage the various complexities of the work," she said. "There's just not adequate resources."

Many of us were very pleased when Pope Francis insisted on appointing abuse survivors to the Catholic Church's Panel to study the sexual abuse by clergy.
Now The Vatican is considering removing the survivor members from the panel and relegating them to another "advisory committee".
The Vatican, the Hierarchy and the clergy in general had no real committment to resolving the abuse issue out of a sense of right and justice.
They were FORCED into taking action about clergy abuse by the world wide scandals and by the media coverage it received - a media coverage that has disillusioned many with the Catholic Church.
They had to be seen doing something and someone in Rome came up with the idea of bringing a few survivors on to the panel - mainly as a PR exercise.
Those survivors have become totally frustrated with this panel as it has achieved very little and as it moves so slowly.
Some of the survivors like Marie Collins of Ireland actually resigned in protest.
When you strip away all the PR you can see that the Hierarchy do not want to lose or forfeit any power to the laity.
They expect the laity to: PAY UP, PRAY UP AND SHUT UP.
Power in the Catholic Church belongs to the Hierarchy and the Clerical Club and the most they want to give the laity is "token power".
The latest development with the Vatican Abuse Commission proves this point.

In the world in general those with power never relinquish it VOLUNTARILY.
It has to be wrestled from them.
Power in the Church belongs with the People of God.
The People of God can wrestle it back by refusing to accept Hierarchal and Clerical dominance and indeed by WITHHOLDING MONEY.
The media has also done us all a great service by highlighting power imbalance and corruption in the Church.
When it comes to the Abuse Commission who has a greater right to be represented there than ABUSE SURVIVORS
Image result for abuse of power


  1. At the moment I am reading Potiphars Wife by Kieron Tapsell. Kieron trained as a priest and became a judge in Australia. The book is a detailed analysis of the problem. The privilege of the clergy was more important than the welfare of the children. Canon law did not allow the bishops to report the crimes. They were under threat of excommunication. It is a very intelligent and well thought out book.

  2. I recall Mons Dermot Farrell saying that Colm O'Gorman was immature and should move on.

    For me that about sums up the clerical position on abuse victims who seek justice. The church would love to see abuse victims ignore their own suffering and walk away (aka, sweep out under the carpet)


  3. This turn of events at the Vatican neither surprises nor disappoints me: it is the sort of duplicity I have come to expect under the watch of His 'Oiliness', Pope Francis.

    My anger is reserved mostly for elderly, unthinking, uncritical Catholic sheep who keep allowing clerical wolves to prey on the innocent by feeding the wolves money, week in and week out.

    Roman Catholic clergy are financial parasites who could be stopped, quite easily, in their predatory tracks, if only elderly Catholics would stop feeding them cash which, through indolence, they neither earn nor deserve.

  4. Yes the Rc church would like to keep the laity ignorant.
    Years ago we were ignorant
    But no thanks to controlled education many have succeeded in educating themselves.

    1. But I am still amazed at the number of intelligent and educated Catholics who will do the bidding of the BISHOP or the priest.

      It's almost like the have a disease of the intellect and conscience.

    2. Not necessarily (@ 10.38)--at all "a disease of the intellect and conscience"! Intelligent and educated Catholics often have a mature approach to life and if they are lucky, they will very likely hold(or have held)positions in life and work where they,themselves exercise authority and so know how difficult that can be and the responsibility that is attached to it. So they understand and respect that others can also have authority and they can maturely accept this without regressing to an unresolved rebellious streak which should have been outgrown in the late teens or soon afterwards. When a man feels confident and happy in his own power, he has room for other people to be the same. He doesn't feel the need to constantly undermine those he perceives to have perhaps more power or job status than he has. He is comfortable in his own skin and not in denial. He also has the ability to recognise his own achievements and that's important too.

    3. 11:31, what a long-winded apology for abuse of 'authority' and for the self-regard of those who exercise such abuse.

      You're one of them, aren't you?

    4. No, Magna.. no.. I am not.

    5. "Unresolved rebellious streak" I am one of the most cooperative people going. At work I would turn my hand to anything to serve the needs of the business and I was aware that things look different from the top. I didn't have their angle on things. At work there was no "mental reservation", people told the truth. Even the Pope is against clericalism. The privileged position of the clergy gave them too much power. Until I worked for the church and witnessed such sloppy work practices, which would have got me sacked at work, I would have agreed with you. Other people pay for the church's mistakes.

    6. Jane, you must allow for the fact that other posters too are speaking from their personal experiences and their perspectives. To write from one's experience is not the prerogative of just one lady.
      So their perspectives are equally valid and I am sure equally sincere.
      There are folk out there who make excellent bosses and at the same time. are able to respect their own supervisors. It's really no big deal.

    7. I don't recall the poster(@11.31)even mentioning "clericalsm". Even when he/she took the column inches to clearly explain, people insisted on putting their own clich├ęd connotation on it!

  5. If God is the Truth, doesn't deliberate lying automatically excommunicate you?

  6. If it is any consolation Magna, I am a social outcast in the parish for suggesting the bishop was less than a saint. My family also accuse me of disloyalty. It's the price I am willing to pay yo keep my integrity.

    1. Jane, you're a martyr for truth, but will never be recognised as such in this finite domain.

    2. Hahaha, that's class.

  7. My family are incredibly well educated and at the top of their professions. However they do not have a prayer life and don't have any sound theological books. They don't have the resources to help themselves.

    1. Congratulations Jane on your integrity.

      Sometimes there is a heavy price to be paid for having integrity.

      But is having integrity not wonderful as you don't live your life in chains like a slave?

    2. Some of you are outcasts of the Church through your own fault and by God you are bitter as a result and by God do we know about it. We just have to look at earlier comments in order to see this. The usual loudmouth Armchair keyboard warrior so- called experts, misfits, disgruntled and with huge chips on your shoulder. Any opportunity to see a reason to attack the Church and you are in there like a flash. You are outcasts for a reason, by your own doing and some of the nasty abusive vitriol emanating from the usual few numpties does make one laugh because it's predictable. When the blog has to rely on said few individuals to support its views says it all quite frankly. Ha ha.

    3. We may be "outcasts of The Roman Empire MK 11 but we are not outcasts of God.

      In fact God loves "outcasts" more than loves brown noses :-)

    4. Jane you deserve the respect that some idiots are too blind to recognise

    5. MourneManMichael25 August 2017 at 21:25

      Anon @ 13:10. the word "outcast" you use infers positive church action to cast out.
      Many who criticise the church, rather than being cast out, have chosen to walk away from an institution they have come to understand as no longer relevant to their understanding of morality, humanity nor spirituality.
      And have no regrets!

    6. Maybe Jane prays and studies all her deep theology books enough to make up for her "incredibly well-educated" family members whom she says "don't have the resources". Tu tut, shame on them! Well, aren't they lucky to have Jane to point out their imperfections and show them how a perfect life should be lived. Yet she feels like an "outcast". Very strange. Maybe somebody could shed some light on it?

    7. MourneManMichael26 August 2017 at 12:07

      Anon @ 21:35: could I suggest you look above and read Sean Page's comment @ 18:44?

  8. 13.10
    What do you mean by using the words ''by God'' twice
    Sounds very intimidating
    So you want to laugh at blog posters...which includes your good self .
    Think you need a course in anti bullying on line.
    Yours has been the only nasty post today.

  9. Far more important was that Basil Hume was an anti-Irish snob (he mocked his auxiliary bishop Patrick O'Donoghue) and he was nominated on class grounds for Westminster by the Duke of Norfolk, William Rees-Mogg and the then Nucio, Bruno Heim (friend of the Queen Mother). Shockingly, his authorised biographer Anthony Howard disclosed Hume's loss of faith on his deathbed, where he sent away the priest offering the Last Rites and the Viaticum. on MASS, EUCHARIST, BREAKING OF BREAD ETC

    in response to Does it matter if Basil Hume was gay? Did he have a partner?

    1. Your post is a completely dishonest misrepresentation of what Howard wrote in his biography. He did not write or even imply that Basil Hume had a loss of faith. What Howard wrote was:
      "Spiritual confidence was, in fact, to mark the very last day of his life. By Thursday 17 June Basil was slipping in and out of consciousness and Jim Curry, sensing that the end could not now be far away, offered either to celebrate Mass or simply to offer him Communion. To his surprise, both offers were rejected, with the dying man murmuring: ‘God will show His love to me in other ways.’ That afternoon his condition deteriorated still further and at around 5.15 p.m. Father Curry anointed him. He died - in the presence of his private secretary, another priest, Father Liam Kelly, one of his nephews and a nurse - just minutes later."

    2. Arlene's on fire25 August 2017 at 18:32

      Why is my post a completely dishonest representation? Mgr Jim Curry offered Mass or just Holy Communion (Viaticum) to the soon to die Basil Cardinal Hume. He declined both. How am I wrong?

    3. Your post stated "Anthony Howard disclosed Hume's loss of faith on his deathbed." There was no loss of faith mentioned or implied in Howard's book as the paragraph I quoted makes clear. Hume was offered communion, he declined, not out of a loss of faith but because he felt at peace in his faith. To say that he had a loss of faith is a dishonest misrepresentation of what Howard relates in his biography. Unless you're telling me you have the power to retroactively know Basil Hume's mind and soul, then I think it's safe to say that you are in no position to comment on the state of his faith.

    4. Pretty striking that a Cardinal declines Holy Communion on his deathbed. Hard to see that as anything other than a lack of faith.

    5. And why was Jim Curry surprised? Because to have any Catholic, never mind a Cardinal, decline Mass or Communion as he was in his last hours is surprising.

  10. I come from Lancashire and if you look below the surface we are mainly of Irish descent. I will apologise on behalf of Basil Hume. I like the Irish they have a warmth and generosity that can be lacking in the English......but I like the English too!!

  11. Abuse issues should be dealt with in the civil jurisdiction in which they allegedly took place by the appropriate authorities

  12. Thank you 14.51...he always did give the appearance of being a snob, maybe because he had Irish ancestors and at that time the Irish were certainly anti British.
    As regards his death bed behaviour, I would put too much emphasis on how he behaved, he prob was partly demented by that stage,.
    Also I'm of the opinion it's how we live our lives that counts, not death bed conversions.
    Thinking of the Irish presenter who died last year...Fr Brian darcy visited him on his deathbed.

    1. I only had one encounter with Basil Hume.

      It was about a classmate who had finished him seminary training and had been ordained a deacon 15 months before.

      Basil was refusing to ordain him a priest and I put in a good word for my friend asking Basil, who kept him for 7 years, would ordaining him not be the most loving thing to do?

      I had a letter from Basil telling me to refrain from lecturing him on love :-)

    2. Thst Brian Darcy character mentioned is just a publicity mad empty head. Wherever celebrities are there is be in the midst of them.

    3. Hardly an objective opinion of Fr D'Arcy who was very highly regarded in The Graan and in St Michael's Parish.

    4. MourneManMichael25 August 2017 at 21:18

      He's 'on the move'. To Tobar Mhuire in Crossgar I hear.
      I'm told there's a very good wine store there. Absolutely no connection I assure you. But knowing +UNOWHO from Somerton Rd uses it, and it is in D&C perhaps a connection might eventually occur?

    5. They'll need to put an annexe onto the Passionist house in Crossgar to accommodate Brian D'Arcy's ego when he moves in.

  13. God knows how any of us will be on our deathbed!

  14. Why wait to be anointed just b4 death
    One can receive the sacrament of the sick monthly at many healing masses
    I never could understand all the rush to get a priest if a person is known to be near's ok if unexpected

    1. @17.5
      Perhaps one day you will understand it, though. As your life goes on, you will gain in empathy and awareness. I hope so anyway(--otherwise life would have taught you nothing!)

    2. 17.52 I always wondered about this preoccupation with death. I think it harps back to the thinking that the purpose of religion is to avoid hell. I agree that anointing is for healing and life

    3. The purpose of religion?
      Basic stuff really... but for anyone who hasn't done his Chapter 1 revision, here goes
      Religion is man's response to God's love. (Everything else stems from that.)

    4. MourneManMichael27 August 2017 at 01:15

      I'm obliged to disagree with your comment Anon @ 21:09.
      Purpose, is an inanimate concept in terms of an aspiration towards causation, and the inanimate concept of religion does not have a purpose. It does however have an effect.
      What you describe as a response is more properly an effect, provided of course that in the first instance one believes in the deity etc.
      And at this late stage of the night, I won't go into the origins of religion in terms of humankind's primitive attempts to make sense of the reality of existence, and inevitability of the non existence of death.
      "Basic stuff really...."

  15. Pat, hadn't Basil the wisdom of the ages to write thus to you. He obviously knees an arrogant git when he read your letter.

  16. I like Irish, English and every other nationality .
    I'm not happy when people make no effort to to speak English after they arrive to work here.

    1. I am sure you give people a nice warm welcome and every help as they struggle to learn English(-even if it is only in order to increase your own happiness) Yes?

  17. JOKE

    A 10 year old boy was knocked down by a car outside the Mater Hospital in Belfast.

    An old lady rushed to his aid covering him with her coat and making a pillow for him with her handbag.

    Then the old lady said to the boy:"Would you like me to get you a priest?

    The little boy replied: "Mrs, do you not think I have enough problems just now?


  18. Pat, now you seek to down a good man Cardinal Hume. How discerning of him to see you as an interfering, troublesome old granny!! Why didn't you ordain yoyr friend? You are profoundly lacking in wisdom and insight. ...

    1. I was not a bishop then.

      I actually liked Cardinal Hume and thought it was good to have a monk at Westminster.

      I do think he was gay.

      He was happy to have sexually active priests in Westminster diocese - always advising them to be "discreet".

      Of course he was a product of the Gay English Benedictines.

  19. Pat yet again your News of the world training leads you to a ridiculous statement about the gay English Benedictine. There are 9 recorded cases involving gay Benedictine in England. Cop on please.

    1. Are you saying that there are only 9 gay Benedictine monks in England?

      If you were claiming that there are 9 heterosexual Benedictine monks in England you would be more accurate :-)

    2. As many as 9 heteros?!

  20. Could Pat please explain how he's able to say with any confidence what a person's sexuality is? And how, unless they are involved in illegal acts, it's any of his or anyone else's business? This blog, at times, seems to be determined to define priests and religious by just one aspect of who they are, namely their sexual identity. Every person is much more that whatever label we feel the need to apply to them in that regard.

    1. If I go to a monastery and many of the monks are quite camp, call each other by girl's names and talk admiringly of other men I think I can think that they might be gay.

      There is absolutely nothing wrong with being gay and I agree it is only a part of the whole person.

      Whether you like it or not the Catholic priesthood is now a predomantly a gay profession.

      The only problem with that is how it might affect straight men with vocations.

    2. ... and a predominantly 'non-celibate' gay profession as the many unworthy acts by pulpit pooves reported here on a regular basis confirm.

  21. Firstly, I have to say I doubt very much that anyone would act in that way around you given the way you use this blog. I just don't find that credible at all. You're not exactly unknown in church circles, and given that you relish "outing" people, I don't believe priests and religious who were inclined to act like that would do so freely in front of you.

    Secondly, your assessments of "campness" are entirely subjective. You're applying a subjective stereotyped monolithic model of heterosexuality and then applying labels on that basis, and then passing off your subjective assessments as some sort of fact. Camp men can be heterosexual. Sexuality is complex and does not fit neatly into predefined boxes.

    1. You also forget the amount of reports and feedback I get from others.

      I agree that occasionally straight men can be effeminate.

      But I think both you and I know the difference between a bit of effeminacy and very camp gay men.

      And I have no problem with camp gay men. I have many as friends.

      I do not know who and what you Are, Anonymous, but I can assure you that the English Benedictines have a reputation for having many Friends of Dorothy.

    2. PS: I don't out people.

      I blog about:

      1. Priests who masturbate on line.

      2. Priests who flash their genitals on line.

      3. Seminarians who engage in promiscuous sex on line.

      4. Seminarians who bully straight seminarians and force them out of seminary.

      5. Priests who make women pregnant and allow them to miscarry alone.

      6. Priests who hang around toilets.


    3. In fairness, you implied you personally had witnessed monks who were camp and calling each other girl's names. To me that would seem to be akin to Charlie Haughey being completely open about his wheelings and dealings with a journalist. I don't see it as being credible given the innate human impulse for self-preservation. I would also question the agenda of those who provide you with feedback, and would prefer to have independent confirmation before I believed it, but I suppose we just have different thresholds in regards to credibility.

      I think your reply shows that you have a predefined categorization for homosexuality and heterosexuality based on external character traits. I think that's a very shallow way of classifying something as complex as sexuality. Even the idea that X level of "campness" is within the bounds of heterosexuality when Y level of "campness" is confirms a person as homosexual is frankly ridiculous. I don't think you will find any credible psychological study to back up the way you decide for yourself who is gay and who isn't on that basis.

    4. I have witnessed priests, monks and seminarians behaving as I say.

      We also have DIFFERENT levels of openness and honesty as I put my name to everything I say and write.

      How can an Anonymous comment maker hold forth about credibility?

      In any event, as Judge Judy says, this is my play pen :-)

  22. 18.13
    I'm almost 80, have been at the bedside of the dying for over 30 years ,so no I won't even try to put numbers on it.
    I still say it's how one lives his/ her life, not what happens on the death bed.
    Thanks Sean for reading my post.
    Witnessing someone dying can be a lovely experience and a privilege.

  23. Sad news in London tonight

    1. And also in Brussels.

      There is a lot of tragic events happening in Europe lately.

      How long before to comes to our shores?

      I read that ISIS are planning an attack on Rome.

  24. A former chaplain to a Glasgow hospital often told the story that one Saturday afternoon he was summoned to the A&E department of the hospital to administer the last rites to a middle aged man who was dying from stab wounds, Having performed his sacred duty the priest asked the dying man if there was anything he could do for him."Yes Father" said the casualty "can you tell me the Score of the Celtic match!!" True story.

    1. We don't use the term "last rites" anymore.

    2. Who is 'we'? I still use it.

  25. I agree. I was with my mother when she died. It was very great privilege

  26. You may not use the term '' last rites'' but most rc's over 65 would still have that term imbedded in their psyche.
    Ma ny will know it as the sacrament of the sick...... but really who cares.
    Extreme unction,anointing, last rites,...I don't know why theses terms needed changed anyways..... a bit like the responses at mass....all an irrelevance

  27. 23.35. That was the name and term used when that incident took place. But thank you for keeping us all right. What would we ever do without correctors like you?