tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post7928482696765872031..comments2024-03-12T19:57:41.861+00:00Comments on THINKING CATHOLICISM: FATHER JAMES DONAGHYThinking Catholicismhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16589713565062075036noreply@blogger.comBlogger39125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-36636284863584061562017-01-04T18:48:31.405+00:002017-01-04T18:48:31.405+00:00Bartlett is a Down and Connor priest with a finger...Bartlett is a Down and Connor priest with a finger in the pies of Armagh and Dublin and a greedy eye on every diocese that becomes vacant. He is currently looking longingly at Clogher as he leafs through his well-thumbed, laminated, Gammarelli catalogues of episcopal lingerie.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-73814242843851329722017-01-04T16:13:44.229+00:002017-01-04T16:13:44.229+00:0006:40, in your very first comment (at 20:18) you s...06:40, in your very first comment (at 20:18) you said the following: 'In relation to Donaghy, Pat, he should be chemically castrated...' You repeated your preference for this extreme and, in my opinion, inhumane penalty at 07:16 and 17:02. Worse, you did so without addressing my point that there is very often more than heightened libido involved in the sexual abuse of children and that your 'solution' ('chemical castration') would not and could not address these psychological components. In your last comment (at 06:40), you finally acknowledged something of these components at Question 3. Yet, knowing that your 'solution' is not holistic (and therefore could not remedy offenders' deviant tendencies and behaviours) you adamantly continued proposing 'chemical castration' as an effective response. <br />Considering all of this, you shouldn't wonder why I judged you as I did; there was no other judgement I could reasonably make. <br /><br />I don't doubt that you have witnessed and heard terrible things concerning sexual abuse of children, and I sympathise deeply with you. You are clearly very emotionally involved in these awful matters, but you have crossed a professional boundary by allowing your understandable anger to warp your intellectual judgement.<br /><br />To address your relevant remaining questions/points to me, as I've already stated, enforcing a regimen of 'chemical castration' on an 'unconscionable pederast/paedophile' (Question 1) would be highly unlikely to prove effective, since factors other than sexual libido are very often involved in the abuse of children, something to which you have not given sufficient weight. 'Chemical castration' could not treat these factors.<br /><br />The word 'pervert' (Point 2) is highly charged, and repeated personal use of it could prove a self-fulfilling prophecy: if you insist on labelling someone a 'pervert', then don't be surprised if he acts like one.<br /><br />Your insistence on using this word points up, again, your lack of professionalism. Why would anyone who seeks to protect children and minors from sexual abuse continue to label offenders with a word that, socially and personally, might 'lock' them into deviant behaviours? And what encouragement has an offender to aspire to personal transformation if you insist on labelling him a 'pervert' for the rest of his life? Prudent and selective use of language is of deep (perhaps crucial) importance when dealing with ALL classes of criminal offender. As a social worker, you should already know this.<br /><br />If an individual is 'utterly convinced that a minor has tried or is trying to seduce them' (Question 3), then these beliefs might suggest a delusional disorder. In which case the person is ill and needs professional help, not condemnation by you as a 'pervert'.<br /><br />As for point 4, libido, as I have already said, is very often not the sole 'driving force' in the sexual abuse of children. You know this as well as I. And you know, too, that 'chemical castration' is not the answer.<br /><br />As for point 6, I did not use the word 'offender' of sexual-abuse victims, but of those who carried out these crimes.<br /><br /><br />Magna Cartahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10242128271477821605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-23958902594229187822017-01-04T06:40:51.976+00:002017-01-04T06:40:51.976+00:00Dear Magna Carta,
You are quick to make a judgeme...Dear Magna Carta,<br /><br />You are quick to make a judgement of me based on a written comment on a blog. I have control of my emotions. I wouldn't be in my job so long otherwise. However, I am entitled to my opinion as you are. <br /><br />You speak much about science and emotions. I can tell you that much of the time science is useless when faced with myriad manifestations of damaged individuals who were subjected to varied hideous gradations of sexual abuse. <br /><br />A definition of science is: the intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behaviour of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment. Believe me when I say that I have seen damage caused by pederasts and paedophiles never seen before by anyone. So scientific methods derived from previously observed instances prove worthless. <br /><br />I have some questions to ask you Magna Carta, along with some answers to your points:<br /><br />1) Do you think that it is worse for an unconscionable pederast/paedophile to suffer the chances of contracting osteoporosis or breast augmentation, etc. than allowing them to wreak destruction on an innocent minor again, and all its ancillary already discussed deleterious effects?<br /><br />2) Again, you have not answered my question asking you if the discussed individuals are not perverts, then what term in the English lexicon would you use to properly describe them?<br /><br />3) How do you psychologically reform an individual who is utterly convinced that a minor has tried or is trying to seduce them?<br /><br />4) You are trying to conflate tendencies of wanting to dominate and physically abuse with same of sexual perversions. While the two perversions are often intertwined, based on my experience the sexual one predominates. I am talking about chemical castration for individuals where sexual perversion is the driving force.<br /><br />5) You talk much about emotions, when one can easily glean from many of your posts that your particular moral edifice is based mainly on emotion and not science.<br /><br />6) You or I or anyone will never be able to plumb the depths comprehensively of a sexual-abuse victim's damaged psyche or, to use your euphemistic term, "offender". Only God himself could do so. You arrogate far too much intellectual power and insight to yourself.<br /><br />Please think about your response to me. <br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-21848935132257424662017-01-03T23:12:38.429+00:002017-01-03T23:12:38.429+00:00About 23 or 24 of Armagh's 60 parishes are in ...About 23 or 24 of Armagh's 60 parishes are in Co. Louth......all of Louth (apart from a small portion of two parishes) is in the diocese of Armagh.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-63500598009821475112017-01-03T17:50:18.102+00:002017-01-03T17:50:18.102+00:0017:02, your attempt at 'ad hominem' ('...17:02, your attempt at 'ad hominem' ('I do not subscribe to Kumbaya political correctness or false mercy principles') was trite and pointless, and only draws attention to your serious lack of professional judgement. <br /><br />You have completely ignored the ethical and scientific principles that I raised in my previous post, about optimising success of 'chemical castration' through voluntary engagement in it, and that dealing with perpetrators' psychological reasons for child-sexual abuse cannot be managed with libidinal suppressants. This, too, underlines your lack of professionalism.<br /><br />Your highly emotional reaction to such a serious issue is so concerning to me that had I your name, I should make a formal complaint against you.<br /><br />You are an emotional time-bomb. I sincerely hope that your worrying lack of professional judgement hasn't damaged individuals and set back responsible treatment programmes for child-sex offenders.Magna Cartahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10242128271477821605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-72527814247443101952017-01-03T17:02:43.512+00:002017-01-03T17:02:43.512+00:00Dear 10:57 & Magna Carta,
My statement is bas...Dear 10:57 & Magna Carta,<br /><br />My statement is based on gritty real-life experience. I do not subscribe to Kumbaya political correctness or false mercy principles. And perverts are actually what they are. What other term would you like to use? And yes, I get extremely angry and disturbed when I see and the sometimes irreparable damage these people have unleashed on innocent minors.<br /><br />I am afraid that this is an issue that I will not sanitise in an effort to appear as a compassionate and caring person. My compassion is all with the victims on this issue.<br /><br />Also 10:57 I never said "most" victims go on to abuse others. You should carefully read my statement before issuing some canned response or a "feel-good-about-myself" answer. <br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-56857791775412816972017-01-03T15:45:37.716+00:002017-01-03T15:45:37.716+00:0007:16, I do not object, in principle, to 'chem...07:16, I do not object, in principle, to 'chemical castration', provided it is voluntary. Apart from the ethical considerations of imposing such an extreme form of treatment, voluntary engagement in in it optimises its chance of success.<br /><br />As a social worker in your field, you should know that heightened sexual libido is only one factor in sexual abuse of children: there can often be other, non-sexual elements, like tendencies to dominate and to use of physical violence.<br />These psychological traits cannot be treated with a drug regimen that 'chemically castrates' (or suppresses sexual desire).<br /><br />Your suggestion that such an extreme treatment ('chemical castration' can cause serious side-effects, like osteoporosis, and breast augmentation) should be imposed on 'these perverts' speaks more of uncontrolled anger than dispassionate, professional judgement.Magna Cartahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10242128271477821605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-2006738293903078102017-01-03T15:37:42.099+00:002017-01-03T15:37:42.099+00:00And here they are - in all their nauseating "...And here they are - in all their nauseating "glory"<br /><br />https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3-fKGZCITIAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-40575834110499717492017-01-03T12:33:32.459+00:002017-01-03T12:33:32.459+00:00So who's dioceses Is Bartlett In, who pays him...So who's dioceses Is Bartlett In, who pays him?<br />How many parishes of Armagh are in Louth?<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-15706878537715528412017-01-03T11:40:00.571+00:002017-01-03T11:40:00.571+00:00If you YouTube Maynooth one can find Timothy all d...If you YouTube Maynooth one can find Timothy all dressed up as some king of 'knight' parading around. In fact there he stands with Brown, Brady and Co! They really are on a different planet, like most clerical types.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-91427945481685698232017-01-03T10:57:59.287+00:002017-01-03T10:57:59.287+00:00Most victims do not go on to abuse others. if anyt...Most victims do not go on to abuse others. if anything, they become hyper-vigilant about abuse and abusers and especially protective of their own children and grandchildren. Some victims do go on to abuse others but the abuse they suffered is no excuse for what they inflict on others. If you have been abused, you should be hyper-sensitive to ensure others do not suffer similar trauma. It should also be remembered that abusers often falsely claim to have been abused themselves in childhood in order to get "sympathy" or a lighter jail sentence when caught.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-8072550081171401172017-01-03T09:37:22.272+00:002017-01-03T09:37:22.272+00:00My thoughts are with Donaghy's victims who, cl...My thoughts are with Donaghy's victims who, clearly, from what I have read, have suffered horribly as a result of his crimes and assaults. Never, in a million years, Pat, will Donaghy seek or accept an offer of help from you or anyone else.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-83230298660423380632017-01-03T07:16:06.498+00:002017-01-03T07:16:06.498+00:0020:18 here Magna Carta and 23:41.
I work as a so...20:18 here Magna Carta and 23:41. <br /><br />I work as a social worker and have seen at close proximity the psychological, emotional and spiritual damage that sexual abuse wreaks on an individual. These victims display a complete lack of self-worth, feelings and thoughts of unnatural guilt and misappropriated blame for the rest of their lives. They can indeed go onto to abuse their own children should they have any, and can be very confused and warped sexually whilst displaying invincible levels of immaturity and general lack of trust in people. <br /><br />As I said the damage caused by men like Donaghy can spiral through generations causing illimitable pain and heartache for all involved including spouses and children. The damage is all the more grave and severe because he was a priest. Just think of how the abused view God, the Church, priests etc for the rest of their lives. <br /><br />I stand by my assertion that these perverts should be chemically castrated and never let near a minor again. Pederasts and paedophiles are the most cunning and deceptive personality types you can meet, and are very prone to recidivism. So yes I would sincerely advocate that they be subjected to the stated treatment, thereby disarming and disabling them for the good of minors everywhere.<br /><br />As an aside, I don't really think some people in the Church here actually realise the damage people like the former Fr Donaghy have caused. This damage was further aggravated of course by the endless cover ups and cowardice of bishops.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-78479284418716768562017-01-03T02:47:22.448+00:002017-01-03T02:47:22.448+00:00Fr Bartlett is not respected by most priests. Many...Fr Bartlett is not respected by most priests. Many view him as a joke similar to the former "Dean" of Belfast who also had desperate episcopal yearnings. <br /><br />Other priests know him as a mischievous schemer who will stop at nothing to get his own way. He is also a very untrustworthy gossip who loves and creates intrigue.<br /><br />He is, nevertheless, a "smooth operator" - an unctuous sycophant - who is able to charm those, in positions of influence, who will be useful to his career. <br /><br />To that end, Timo has been feverishly courting Nuncio Charlie Brown and, most of all, Sean Baptist Wounding Hurter Brady has been invaluable to Tim in that respect.<br /><br />Fr Tim Bartlett served as Brady's spin doctor very faithfully and Brady is doing his damnedest to "reward" Fr Bartlett. The same Brady, of course, has also been pushing the "career" of Fr Pry-er.<br /><br />A number of bishops were surprised that Fr Bartlett was appointed General Secretary for the World Meeting of Families. Again, the Wounding Hurter's hand is seen in this. <br /><br />Brady, as a Cardinal, undoubtedly still has "influence" and, getting this prominent role for his "ever so humble and faithful servant", is another way of getting him "noticed" for a bishopric.<br /><br />Brady is stubborn as a mule when it comes to getting his way and Bartlett, DETERMINED to be a bishop, will not rest until he is mitred and enthroned over some poor diocese. <br /><br />Machiavelli is alive and well in the RC Church. It remains to be seen though if the Wounding Hurter and his oily spin doctor's schemes succeed.<br /><br />Observer.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-76255783992001105752017-01-02T23:57:44.516+00:002017-01-02T23:57:44.516+00:00Yes, for his sake and that of his victims, he abso...Yes, for his sake and that of his victims, he absolutely should re-locate.Magna Cartahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10242128271477821605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-83241281202257522532017-01-02T23:47:21.904+00:002017-01-02T23:47:21.904+00:00What about his victims? Don't think he thought...What about his victims? Don't think he thought a lot about them before their attacks.... don't wish any harm on another being, but think he should have thought a little about where to start afresh & to move on and start a new somewhere else.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-70306020675396012842017-01-02T23:41:01.037+00:002017-01-02T23:41:01.037+00:00Thank you Magna Carta! 20:18 you should seriously ...Thank you Magna Carta! 20:18 you should seriously think about what you have said! Victims are damaged enough without these poorly thought, generalised statements. It's not difficult for any person to know what actions are morally right from those that are absolutely wrong. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-81832066969012378232017-01-02T23:05:47.918+00:002017-01-02T23:05:47.918+00:00You were ejected from Ireland? What? By paramilita...You were ejected from Ireland? What? By paramilitaries? Magna Cartahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10242128271477821605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-32968516636545754712017-01-02T21:38:09.326+00:002017-01-02T21:38:09.326+00:0016.42 I agree. When I was ejected from Ireland I l...16.42 I agree. When I was ejected from Ireland I landed in the UK. Thank God things worked out. However people like donaghy are bound by legal constraints that will follow them for life. I think in the past UK gave a person a degree of annonimity if they were prepared to give it a go. Nowadays social media had shrunk the worldFly on Th Wallhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12520198020314816276noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-74338093410733674732017-01-02T21:33:42.431+00:002017-01-02T21:33:42.431+00:0012:55... I echo your feelings and sentiments. Pats...12:55... I echo your feelings and sentiments. Pats a self-righteous man that professes to be Christian. Genuine Christians don't follow Sunday tabloids for a story.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-80105460475617909172017-01-02T20:58:36.111+00:002017-01-02T20:58:36.111+00:0020:18, at what evolutionary stage are you stuck? M...20:18, at what evolutionary stage are you stuck? Moral Neanderthal?Magna Cartahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10242128271477821605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-64476519536756685642017-01-02T20:56:00.160+00:002017-01-02T20:56:00.160+00:00Agreed. That headline is inflammatory and irrespon...Agreed. That headline is inflammatory and irresponsible.<br /><br />It sets up Jim Donaghy as a hate-figure and as fair-game for any vigilante. <br /><br />If Donaghy is attacked, that newspaper may bear a heavy moral responsibility (if not a legal one).Magna Cartahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10242128271477821605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-28827641321093759192017-01-02T20:42:23.921+00:002017-01-02T20:42:23.921+00:00People only understand things on their level of pe...People only understand things on their level of perception.<br />For example, to some people priest or bishop = good and holy man.<br />So when someone else tells them that a priest is engaging in crimes which are covered by his bishop, that is so far outside their reality they will never believe it.<br />This is one of the reasons paedophiles seek trusted professions (in addition to contact with children): it gives them a front which is difficult to contradict.<br /><br />The people who believe priest = good will also see the person exposing corruption and deceit among priests, as the villain themselves.<br />This is why whistle blowers always get villified - they have seen what others don't and it threatens the others' reality.<br />Mary O'Brien doesn't have to be pretending or stoned (although your comment made me lol, seminarian), just a victim of the *centuries* of propaganda the church has put in to promoting the ritual purity and perfect chastity of its clergy.<br />However. Mary, if you have a specific criticidm of Pat's treatment of a bishop, I'm sure he will publish it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-30414896453308572042017-01-02T20:26:38.944+00:002017-01-02T20:26:38.944+00:00In Pat's last blog titled Fr Donaghy, on the 2...In Pat's last blog titled Fr Donaghy, on the 24th Dec, having read many negative comments concerning Fr Timothy Bartlett, I queried in a comment if all those comments could possibly be wrong, and invited comment as to whether he had any redeeming qualities.<br /><br />That was over a week ago. In the interim there have been some withering criticisms of him, with a consensus that he appears to be wholly concerned with his own self advancement through fawning sycophantic behaviour vis a vis the RC hierarchy. No hard 'evidence' of misdemeanour was given and as one comment rightly pointed out, it could be said that negative comments are based solely on personal perceptions. Mind you one person I discussed this with pointed out that often self serving aspirational individuals are astute enough to ensure their 'hands are never caught in the till', by 'keeping their nose clean', and 'providing the bullets for others to fire'.<br /><br />What seems certainly remarkable though, appears to be the strength of negativity concerning him, and the reality that with a week plus having elapsed, there was not one single supportive redeeming quality reported on in comments here.<br />Now I have no axe to grind, and whether or not he gets his 'pointy hat' makes absolutely no difference to me. But I just hope, having read so much now about the failures and poor leadership of the Irish RC episcopy, that the papal nuncio and anyone else involved in bishop selection procedures will take note of what has been said here, and what has failed to be said.<br />MMMMourneManMichaelnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3543129696041324861.post-48402423614840203122017-01-02T20:18:39.461+00:002017-01-02T20:18:39.461+00:00Mrs O'Brien you are betraying an uncommon naiv...Mrs O'Brien you are betraying an uncommon naivety and complete lack of cognitive awareness.<br /><br />In relation to Donaghy Pat, he should be chemically castrated and never let near a minor again. Men like him leave scars that reverberate through generations often leading to a vicious cycle of abused turning into abuser.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com