Friday, 25 May 2018

NO GAYS IN SEMINARIES - POPE



Pope Francis on homosexual seminarians: This bridge is closed!




At Vatican Insider I spotted something interesting.  Each Spring the Italian bishops have a plenary meeting at the Vatican’s Paul VI hall, in the smaller hall where the Synod usually meets.  The Pope attends at least part of the meeting.  This year was no exception.

This year the Pope told them… my fast translation from the Italian original:
“If there’s a doubt about homosexuality, it’s better not to have them enter the seminary.”
The words of the Pope in the closed door session with the Italian bishops: “Discernment is needed”. Reaffirmed what was in the Vatican documents of 2005 and 2016
With the pastors of the CEI (Italian bishops conference) – Vatican insider learned – Francis, speaking about the downturn in vocations, one of his “three worries” for the Italian church, he was, instead, more straightforward and, inviting the bishops to oversee more the quality of future priests, then the quantity, explicitly mentioned cases of homosexual persons who desire, for various motives, to enter into the seminary.

Then he invited the bishops to a “careful discernment”, adding: “if you have also the slightest doubt it’s better not to let them enter”.

One indication, from the Pope, that expresses his deep concern: these tendencies, which are “deeply rooted”, and the practice of “homosexual acts”, can compromise the life of the seminary beyond that of the young man himself and an eventual future priesthood. They can generate those “scandals” of which the Pope had spoken in his discourse at the opening of the assembly of the Italian bishops in the new hall of the Synod, that disfigure the face of the Church.
Between the lines one can read what was already put in black and white by Pope Francis in a letter of meditation given brevi manu [directly] to the Chile in bishops during their meeting in the Vatican. In a note added to the text. The Pontiff denounced verified problems in seminaries where – as he wrote – bishops and religious superiors have entrusted control to “priests suspected of practicing homosexuality”.

There’s more, but it mainly reviews what previous documents say about homosexual candidates or seminarians.  I suspect someone will translate the whole thing soon… for the sake of general Jesuit reading.

To the bishops: “If you think that the guy is homosexual, don’t put him in the seminary.”
The Pontiff – the Pontifex… “Bridge Builder” – says that “This bridge is closed!

I wonder what that means for those who are already ordained.


PAT SAYS:

If Pope Francis' teachings were followed at least 80% - if not more - seminarians would have to be dismissed from RC seminaries.




And the 20 in Maynooth would then drop to 3 or 4.

And then what do you do with the church's 4AA50,000 priests - the majority of whom are gay?




The RC Church has two options:

1. Drop the requirement of celibacy and allow priests - straight and gay - to date and have wives, husbands, and partners.

2. Kep the celibacy law in place and:

a. Refuse to accept seminarians who do not keep celibacy.

b. Sack any priest that breaks his celibacy promises.

At the moment many priests are having their cake and eating it.

They have the safety, status and benefits of the priesthood and they are having sex on the side with women and men - mainly men.



I also think that many seminarians and priests are being dishonest and are lying and living a double life.

On the one hand, they teach RC teachings from the pulpit and 5 minutes later they are in bed with their beau.

All of this hypocrisy and double living is absolutely destructive of a spirituality.

Its one of the big reasons why Catholic churches are emptying and the whole thing is going down the tubes.


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OSCOTT SEMINARY





A visitor to Oscott writes:




"Candidates for the Permanent Diaconate in Oscott Seminary are known as ‘permos’ and they refer to the seminarians as ‘pink palace’.

Many of the seminarians can’t deal with married men coming into the seminary, they won’t speak with them or join them at the table to eat, also it is interesting to see the dislike like they have towards women it makes them feel very uncomfortable when they are around in the seminary.




I am surprised you don’t know about the condom scandal that happened some time ago ……… The Archbishop is just ignoring the problem.

Pat I would encourage you to Dig Dig Dig – Father David Marsden who was at Maynooth went to Oscott and is no longer there…………….. why??????? The homosexuality is very big in Oscott and they could not deal with a priest who was trying to help seminarians understand who they are!!

He has just been removed the ‘pink palace’ is doing very well under the Rector and there is (an interesting story if it is true the seminarians dressed up like cats for a wine party) Pat……. One can only guess why…………."


93 comments:

  1. In Auckland, New Zealand, the Chancery is painted a gawdy pink and is appropriately known as the 'pink palace'.

    ReplyDelete
  2. I remember entering Seminary in 2009. My bishop got the psych report. His only comment was to express his surprise that I was heterosexual. A few years in Maynooth and I fully understood why. It was a most disappointing experience being disillusioned.

    You mention the drop in maynooth from circa 20 to circa 4. Dont forget the departure of Mullanney in that outflux.

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    Replies
    1. Back then it was Xxxx O'Xxxx Xxxx's room where all the gay action was. He destroyed a generation of semiinarians before leaving to be an airhost and publically admit his orientation. A horrible man

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  3. How can you keep celibacy and allow partners. The issue is not orientation but an appropriate way to express ones sexuality.

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    Replies
    1. It's none of your Protestant business.

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    2. 13:05 has a cheek to write this on the very day that the Yes vote showed that Roman Catholicism in Ireland has been reduced to an insignificant and impotent rump of religious extremists.

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    3. They'reot insignificant, nor impotent.

      But at prsent they're without any sensible leadership.

      The Irish RCC would be in better shape if all the present bishops were put into Old People's Homes.

      The people in the pews need to be motivated and properly instructed.

      You can't do that with just a five-minute homily on Sunday morning.

      And an appropriate text for this morning's homily might be Malachi 3:16 - 'Then those that feared God spoke together ... '

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  4. You seem to completely miss the point: the Church cannot allow homosexual seminarians because homosexual acts are an abomination in God's eyes. The Old & New Testaments, Sacred Tradition and the constant Magisterium of the CC are in complete harmony in regard to homosexual acts. The priesthood is not the place for homosexuals.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. A chaste homosexual is equal to a chaste heterosexual

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    2. Oh, I bet you are a prissy queen yourself, all frustrated and self-hating ! When I hear people like you talk about homosexuals with such venom, I know that it is because you are one yourself, you are self-loathing and so unhappy, that you simply have to excrete such hatred, venom and bile in order to make yourself feel better. Not nice ! Poor you.

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    3. Francis must be a prissy queen as well? Take it up with God 14:37!You can't tolerate His Holy WORD.

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    4. 09:24, has Pope Francis called upon his fellow bishops to reject straight candidates for seminary should their ability to live within the sometimes-testing constraints of celibacy be questionable? If he has, I'm not aware of it.

      This move by Francis is a bone fide expression of homophobia. It has been prompted by fear and prejudice (vis a vis gay men), and not by knowledge and reason.

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    5. Sadly I agree, Magna Carta, the pope is not as gay-friendly as he thinks he is, or as he has led people to think he is.

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    6. The Pope has read the reports out of Maynooth and has come to his own conclusion. Enough is enough!

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    7. Can anyone help? When I try to post comments, I click on 'Publish' and the orange Blogger logo flickers. I then lose my comment.

      It's very frustrating.

      Delete
    8. 18:03, if the pope has read these reports, then he has indeed come to his own (wrong) conclusion: that all gay men are sexually active and promiscuous.

      You are right about one thing: enough is surely enough...of homophobic prejudice by men who ought to know better.

      Delete
    9. So glad to hear that Blogger is blocking blue Magna's comments.

      Delete
  5. Morning Pat... I don't get McConnell's interest in this Story.
    One minute he posts on FB that he's 'now not a Catholic' and now he's posting that this is indeed an interesting story that the church may have gay/ married Priest's!
    Is it his sexuality which he's struggling with or just so much time on his hands being retired at such a young age!!!
    He puzzles and embarrasses me.

    Middletown Resident.

    ReplyDelete
  6. He has a Mobility car, paid for by the non-retired.

    ReplyDelete
  7. Is there any point in Francis coming to the World Meeting of Families now? It's a bit ironic in light of the baby killing yes vote.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Why was Francis silent during the campaign? Was it his need to be popular winning out yet again?

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    2. McConnell is Pat Buckley's special representative in Armagh Archdiocese, though Pat refuses to confirm it even though we all know.

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    3. Who cares whether he comes or not.
      He isn’t god

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    4. He thinks he is, as do his devotees.

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    5. 13.05 You are a bigot and an online bully. Wise up. Get a life

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    6. Shoudn't you be at Evensong?

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    7. Hate speech like yours needs to be dealt with by the law. Ireland unlike Britain has given approval to abortion on demand. Britain merely chooses to ask no questions if medics agree with the abortion. Abortion is technically illegal in the UK and happens because it is tolerated. The next step needs to be the prevention of society destroying women by accusing them of cruelty and murder when they have an abortion.

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    8. 18.07 Bless your little cotton socks Sure ya love everyone really

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  8. Easily embarrassed.Everyone entitled to an opinion on any subject no matter what your faith.

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  9. The permanent diaconate is a farce. No young man ever grew up with the dream of being a permanent deacon. It's a way of clericalysing married male parish busybodies. When married priests come in the permos will be upgraded and the PDs will disappear.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Someone who thinks the diaconate is beneath his dignity should not think of ministry at all.

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  10. You have been misinforned and misled on Oscott. It seems strange that you base your info only on a visitor to the seminary who suddenly becomes an expert on the place

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    Replies
    1. My visitor is an important regular visitor with special insight.

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  11. “At the moment many priests are having their cake and eating it.”

    Remember KOB, +Pat, he had his steak and blowjob too.

    ReplyDelete
  12. 1-1 of 1

    The Bishop of Kerry needs to have a serious discussion with Mark Moriarty. activity especially when it breaks a wrist.

    ReplyDelete
  13. Concentrate on Maynooth, +Pat, you can close down Oscott later.

    ReplyDelete
  14. As a gay man with a faith in God I am saddened by this article. I am also disappointed as I served as an active member of this church however no longer for obvious reasons

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  15. Pat your Maynooth concerns blog was a complete success. There has been no more gay activity in the rabbit room on the corridor. Keep up the good work and if i may look into the relationship between Xxxxxx and Xxxxx Xxxxxxx. It goes beyond the normal imagination.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Send Eamon Martin an email naming them.

      admin@aracoeli.com

      Send me copy

      bishopbuckley1@outlook.com

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    2. It sounds very romantic.

      Delete
  16. Hi Pat

    The differences between Roman Catholic seminaries and Church of England theological colleges are huge. I have visited many Church of England theological colleges and the freedom, warmth and acceptance of sexuality is just wonderful to experience.

    Two great colleges - Ridley Hall and Westcott House in Cambridge show how training for clergy should be done. It is such a shame the Roman Catholic seminaries don't follow their example.

    God Bless you Pat. Have you ever visited any of our Church of England colleges?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Hi. Thank you.

      Interesting.

      I have never visited a Church of England college unfortunately.

      I did visit and speak to the students at the Church of Ireland college in Dublin.

      I liked it and was given a warm welcome.

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    2. In the CofE (lol) colleges they give students women's names.

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    3. The differences between Catholic seminaries and CoE (lol) colleges are indeed huge. The Catholic ones produce real, validly ordained priests whereas the Anglican orders are absolutely null and utterly void.

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    4. The fact that Maynooth has an LGBT Society says it all.

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    5. Follow the example of the Church of England? Their evangelisation has been so successful. NOT

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    6. That is very insulting to all Church of England members. Even recent popes have not expressed the cruel "invalid, null and void" nonsense.

      I don't remember Pope Benedict bringing that up in his visit to England and his meeting with Queen Elizabeth II, do you?

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    7. Hi Bishop Pat. I have some information about a few things to seek your advice on. Is it ok to email you? Thanks

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    8. 14:49, exactly what does it say?

      Is it wrong that a demographic which has so often been the object of prejudice, hatred, and violence should seek a voice for itself?

      Delete
    9. 16:46

      Of course.

      bishopbuckley1@outlook.com

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  17. The Maynooth formation team should attend an LGBT workshop.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Like taking coal to Newcastle.

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  18. The Maynooth LGBT society must suppprt Xxxxxx and Xxxxxx LOve is love.

    ReplyDelete
  19. I went to Maynooth to visit a friend 3 years ago and was propositioned 3 times, one of them clearly had an erection.

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    Replies
    1. Typical Maynooth, it's a bathhouse. To think that these men will be in parishes. It's horrifying.

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    2. Back in Frank Duhig's day as Senior Dean I went back to the college to stay overnight. I was joined by a Westminster sem. We were given seperate rooms in St Mary's.

      He had worked out that the form was to put your name and diocese on the card holder on the bedroom door, as is the Maynooth custom.

      He told me that as soon as they saw "Westminster" his door was rapped constantly and he didn't get a wink of sleep.

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  20. The Pope needs to be careful. There are many of us about, priests who are gay, the vast majority of whom live good and decent lives, and work extremely hard in difficult circumstances, and always have done. Yes, like many other people, we can fall and sin. But we are committed to the Gospel and to the Church. It's bad enough to have a Church which uses offensive language about you - all that intrinsically disordered stuff - but to have a Church that wants to eradicate us from the future of the Church simply means that the Church will not have the great blessing of our ministry in the future, not to mention how hurtful it is to be told that our sexuality counts for more than our witness and ministry over the generations. The Holy Father is at risk of sounding like some pig ignorant oaf when he starts talking like this. He needs to weigh up very carefully the great blessing of his clergy, including the gays, and perhaps extend to us some of the mercy and welcome which he tells us to extend to the faithful.

    The issue our Church has is that it is stuck in a rut over it's understanding and appreciation of sexuality. It has to do with a past reading of scripture and bad theology which has been surpassed by new thinking and understanding, and which many other Churches have embraced, rightly so. We need to catch up. And begin to value people for their dignity, their worth, their gifts, rather than seeing everything and judging everything through the lens of the genitals and the loins.

    And. please, you more hard line contributors, spare me a scriptural diatribe such as at 0924. Get over it !

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    Replies
    1. An alleged priest who describes Scripture as a diatribe. Maybe the Protestants are right in saying that Catholics have no respect for the Bible.

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    2. Sanctimonious, he did not describe scripture as a diatribe, just as to call someone a biblical fundamentalist is not to disparage scripture. Your respect for the Bible is touching.

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    3. 14:57, not all of Scripture is 'God-breathed'. Jesus himself challenged the moral validity of parts of the Old Testament.

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    4. "Spare me a scriptural diatribe" he said.

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  21. Membership of the Church is voluntary. Do the free house and the stipend and stole fees influence your decision to stay, Fr? Do you as a celibate want to have your cake and eat it?

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    Replies
    1. The cake eater in question is not celibate/chaste. The lack of catechesis for 50 years has lead to today's referendum result.

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  22. I’ve always suspected a lot of the Clergy were Gay. It didn’t really matter to me as long as they were good Priests. It’s only after reading this blog that I see it’s a much bigger thing than one might have thought.

    Perhaps celibate and non-celibate Orders are the ticket? By non-celebrate I don’t mean a car keys in a bowl type situation. But an Order where people are free to peruse loving monogamous relationships.

    We need something to keep the numbers up!

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    Replies
    1. I’ve always suspected a lot of married men are gay or bisexual, it didn’t matter to me as long as they were good people. Just following your own logic there 16.57.

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    2. 18:45, you'd be gobsmacked if you knew how many married 'heterosexual' men are actually gay or bisexual.

      An acquaintance of mine, who was wont to visit the Giant's Ring (maybe still does!), said that he was amazed to discover so many married men there from his hometown.

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  23. LANCASTER

    Bishop Pat. You are aware of the retirement of Bishop Campbell from Lancaster. His secretary resigned last to take a few months sabbatical and is now based at SJV Blackpool with his newly ordained friend. I’d love to be a fly on the wall in that Presbytery. In a few months time he is off to study Canon law in Canada. Why should Parish money be used to pay for his stay in this Parish when he isn’t even contributing to our pastoral care and why should Diocesan money be used for his studies in Canada when we have plenty Canon lawyers already and a significant shortage of Priests in our Diocese. This man from Maynooth hasn’t ever served in a Parish and will be close to 50 before he does. I am writing to the new Bishop to complain but I won’t expect a response. I was also astonished to see the Diocesan Social Media pages last week when Billing told the world he was leaving his post. A huge fuss was made and the publicity was far more than if a Pope had died.

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    Replies
    1. Diocesan priests nearing 50 who've never been in a parish are a disgrace. Imagine a GP who proposed doing that. It wouldn't be allowed. Fr Paul Prior is to receive his first pastoral appointment at the age of 51.

      I'm sure +Pat that you started off in parish ministry at the age of 24, 25, which is what most priests do.

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    2. I Did.

      It's where priests should be.

      Desk jobs should be done by qualified lay men and women.

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    3. Completely true, +Pat that desk jobs should be done by lay men and women. Its a career, supports a family and frees up a young priest to give his energy to a parish. Priests being ordained to spend decades as secretaries, canon lawyers, British army chaplains, teachers/lecturers or working in the Roman Curia are a total disgrace.

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    4. I have written to the new Bishop raising concerns about the aforementioned press release that was way over board for a Priest. Parishioners at SJV Parish should withold their money and should not be paying for his keep. That Parish is already going down hill. The young curate walks the grounds in a cassock and hat with a pom pom and the PP lives elsewhere. They are begging for mass stipends in their newsletter and it is clear that Parishioners are not happy with the current situation. The newly ordained curate prefers Latin Mass and dress. Strange but God has a plan I am sure.

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    5. And why are army chaplains a disgrace 18:17? I have friends who are both Anglican and Catholic Army Chaplains and they work hard. Are those in the military to be denied pastoral care?

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    6. Of course armies need chaplains. The reference is to a priest of Cloyne (Cork) who is a BA chaplain.

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    7. Quite an actively gay cleek in the Chaplaincy Dept of of the army I believe?

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  24. It is high time this bigot who is no better than a racist - remember a person who discrimates against you for who you love is worse and more dangerous than one who discriminates against you because of your skin - was disinvited from this country. Leo Vardadkar needs to wise up. Who needs a man coming here who thinks women who have abortions are murderers? The yes vote has won but women are still be demonised by social pressure if they want an abortion or need one. The sooner social media tries to deal with Francis the better.

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  25. Paul Prior has a thing for Stephen Wilson. Prior has a fascination for Ryanair cabin crew.

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  26. I can wait to visit Fr Paul Prior in parish. King puck, Moriarty and Fr Derwin are eager to have a sleep over in Prior's parochial hse.

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  27. I've just been informed that the 'Yes' campaign in the Republic of Ireland was successful.

    I want to congratulate the clergy of the institutional Roman Catholic Church for this historic victory. Had it not been for your Christ-betraying behaviour, for generations, this victory would not have been possible.

    Well done, you good and faithful servants.

    You shall receive the reward you richly deserve when you eventually come to me.

    The One You Betrayed.

    Jesus

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  28. Time to put little Timmy Bartlet in a parish to get the smell of the sheep about him - the parish dodger that he is

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    Replies
    1. In the words of the late Dr Ian Paisley "never, never, never". Timmy's vocation is to the episcopate, not the presbyterate.

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  29. I think Francis' words need to be parsed more minutely here. It seems to me that what he is speaking about is not a doubt about whether an applicant may be gay, but a doubt relating to a different matter about an applicant who is gay.

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    Replies
    1. His meaning is quite obvious.

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    2. Nuance means nothing to you.

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  30. Does anyone know where I can find Mass in Lancaster Diocese that isn’t Syro Malabar, Latin, Neo Cat or Ordinariate? All I want is the Roman Rite and it is so difficult to come by. I was in the states for 10 years and have come back to find all this carry on and our younger priests seem all wearing old fashioned cassocks, Tommy Cooper type hats and talking down to us. My own Parish has an ex Anglican Priest who is married with children yet up the road the other Priest needs to be celibate. I am worried that our Diocese is dying.

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    Replies
    1. I presume that you are referring to Holy Family Blackpool as the Priest there is an Ordinariate but rarely says the Ordinariate Mass as unlike him, no other Anglicans in this Diocese transferred over. It is a bit odd that he isn’t celibate and others are, I agree. Your other local Parishes are Sacred Heart and St Kentigerns, both are excellent Parishes. I’d stay clear of the other Blackpool Parishes if your preference isn’t the Latin, Syro Malabar or Polish Masses.

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    2. Give our new Bishop time and he will sort all of this out!! It will take time to dismantle the +Bishop Billing years.

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  31. What is going on in Archdiocese of Glasgow? The Archbishop has just appointed 2 Canons who are in their 30’s and very much favour the Traditional Mass and dressing up in all the old fashioned vestments. He also told us 3 years ago that the Holy Father granted a request to appoint an Auxiliary Bishop. We can only assume that either nobody suitable has been found or those offered have rejected it. I suspect that as several of the senior clergy there are actively homosexual, they would feel it is not worth the risk to be closed. I hear that Fr Xxxx Xxxxxx was offered it a few months ago and turned down the Nuncio! The Archdiocse seems to have lost its way.

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    Replies
    1. As a former Priest of said Archdiocese, I assure you that the Archbishop tries his best. He is a good guy. The 2 recent Canons Garagro and Sharkey are young but are stars of the future, even if they do prefer the Latin rite. To my knowledge, 3 have been offered the Auxiliary post. 2 declined and the offer was withdraw from the 3rd. I hear that Monsignor Hugh Canon Bradley was also a favourite but his health ruled him out. God has a plan and we must all be patient.

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    2. The gay clique in Glasgow all got pulled in by the Archbishop following the KOB scandal and warned to lay low and to refrain from getting themselves into trouble! They have calmed down quite a bit recently. Even a well know and actively gay Monsignor has managed to be discreet. Happy days.

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    3. If you are a former Priest why are you even bothered? Your info isn’t completely right either although I do think that Monsignor Bradley who is our current PP would be a good choice. Great intellect, great preacher and good sense of humour.

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  32. Why did Hughie protect Stephen Wilson over a sexual harassment case. The famous educational settlement.

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  33. Pat the new Maynooth seminary cruising joint has been relocated to Panti Bar on Capel street. The George account has been closed down as there is to many journalists investigating Byrne and Derwin. Pat drop in some night.

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    Replies
    1. 22.55 Learn to write English properly you ignoramus.

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